Transcript of RuneScape Podcast #85 - Bandos, Balance, Rules and Tools

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[00:13] welcome to this week's runescape podcast
[00:15] I'm mod mapped heed the podcast monkey
[00:17] and this week we're straight into it
[00:19] with models born law corner and all
[00:21] things Bandos welcome to our little law
[00:24] ghana on more dos one we I've got mud
[00:26] Rolly mud Raven and watch Steve and this
[00:28] time round we're talking about big old
[00:30] band us a big high war God where do we
[00:32] start
[00:35] spoilers oh my gosh boiler by now people
[00:40] you still reeling is to my name that's
[00:41] why I wanted to get a quick man das was
[00:43] around with the God letters was I'm
[00:45] pretty sure I see I've got this kind of
[00:47] memory hazy memory of him looking like a
[00:48] goblin he's home the older ones yeah
[00:50] yeah so has been around kinda from the
[00:52] start yeah I think this since the Goblin
[00:54] series started yeah yeah absolutely
[00:56] I'm which is a good place to kind of
[00:57] kick off cuz I'm banned oz for me was
[01:00] the first one to really push possibly
[01:02] even break the Enix I always remember
[01:04] chosen quite a fantastic question I love
[01:06] the kpop in serozha thought or Johnny
[01:08] did a great job noise but like I'm the
[01:09] chosen commander you know he has an
[01:11] avatar that takes over a person's body
[01:14] and then start stomping stomping around
[01:15] I remember the dates correctly gone
[01:17] directly manipulate the game yeah and I
[01:25] always thought that was the biggest
[01:26] purse so my first impression from
[01:27] bandhas was that use the most cheeky do
[01:29] you have any other kind of initial first
[01:31] impressions of Bandos he was a great
[01:33] strategist yeah is the thing that people
[01:35] often overlooked with manners because
[01:36] it's those big high war god and so they
[01:38] think mmm big strength I would hit
[01:40] things smash but he was a master
[01:42] strategist that's why he was able to
[01:44] break the eggs well sort of twist the
[01:46] yes because he worked out
[01:48] he had a plan in advance so he had that
[01:51] plan set in motion he had everything
[01:52] going to yeah convert you know
[01:55] poor old zanuck into his kind of you
[01:57] know flashy puppet and all of this would
[02:01] have taken a great deal of forward plan
[02:03] this is you know it was what centuries
[02:05] of planning yeah so he's a good
[02:07] strategist I liked also want to maintain
[02:11] long-term wolf fear you can't just go
[02:12] around hitting things is a slow burner
[02:15] because it was very easy and very troll
[02:18] push I guess for the kind of a leader of
[02:21] all the goblins and orcs
[02:22] ogres and troll
[02:23] to be brutish and simple and yeah again
[02:27] I think it was part of that wanting to
[02:30] have gods who had positives and
[02:32] negatives to have flaws and like things
[02:34] to attract followers and before that
[02:38] Banda's was all floors basically yeah so
[02:41] giving him that intelligence that
[02:42] strategy it's like you wouldn't expect
[02:44] it obvious is something to look up to it
[02:47] yeah to revere yeah absolutely which
[02:50] kind of fed into and I was skipping a
[02:52] little bit ahead here but the talk about
[02:55] the concept of bandhas when we first so
[02:58] the first concept which i think is like
[02:59] as habits in the public domain was of
[03:02] effectively the MU Mac in Lord of the
[03:04] Rings Return of the King yeah was this
[03:06] the little goblins on his shoulder yeah
[03:08] and that complete them well it's a
[03:09] beautiful concept it completely devalued
[03:11] bandulus you have this effectively felt
[03:14] like those small goblins were
[03:15] controlling that just has you know the
[03:18] eastern riders were controlling the
[03:19] movement you know it's moving band or
[03:21] surround or hit this go destroy that
[03:23] City so we kind of pulled back again and
[03:26] we had another crisis just like with our
[03:27] middle and sat down and discussed right
[03:29] what his band on us
[03:31] and I think we picked up on some story
[03:33] that he was of the last of his race
[03:35] yeah after having killed the rest of it
[03:37] I think was that the race were very you
[03:43] know like the Kaiser was very very
[03:44] tournament oriented very if you want to
[03:46] be leader than you must have figure yeah
[03:48] certainly the the race he came from or
[03:50] the planning he came from in the races
[03:52] there were very warlike yes so there was
[03:54] also the world ending event that was
[03:56] coming for them the meteors modeling
[03:58] world ending but yes I can't I can't
[04:01] remember his name was much axe wasn't it
[04:03] yeah Joe doe do not take Chi or
[04:06] something Joe do what to kite something
[04:09] like like I don't recall exactly but
[04:12] yeah that that idea that he was keeping
[04:15] the planet safe but yeah all the time
[04:17] all the people on the planet were just
[04:18] killing each other yeah it was an
[04:21] interesting origin story and then we
[04:23] were kind of thinking about well what
[04:24] would he look like he's not gonna look
[04:25] like a trolley company look no girl we
[04:26] want to push that look out there but we
[04:28] still want him to feel bigger than the
[04:31] other gods there was a case of we wanted
[04:32] that outline to just be you know larger
[04:35] than the others we got a lot of course
[04:36] liked humanoid
[04:37] made God's there and then so we kind of
[04:39] thought right bulky was the one of their
[04:40] bulky weren't that kind of burning
[04:42] intensity intelligence in the eyes and
[04:44] the idea of this kind of walking suit of
[04:45] armor started coming in I was the kind
[04:47] of the first step we like that but then
[04:49] we thought there was an element of the
[04:50] Raptor to it I remember when we had the
[04:52] idea of what was underneath it yes as
[04:54] well which was that wonderful thing
[04:55] saying let's take a rhino and let's take
[04:58] a shark
[04:59] terrifying things and if we squished
[05:02] them together and that's kind of it was
[05:03] it was they took our kill it so
[05:06] intelligent killer yeah notion of the
[05:07] assassin we were looking around kind of
[05:10] the animal world because we know it was
[05:11] a beast like feeling and a different
[05:13] silhouette not necessary completely
[05:14] humanoid and we're looking the animal
[05:16] kingdom for that kind of intelligent
[05:17] kalo we were looking at you know Eagles
[05:19] known as to armadale yeah and then we
[05:21] came to the great white shark but having
[05:23] a god that looked like shark attack out
[05:25] there you know he's probably when we've
[05:27] gone down to well oh but there are
[05:30] certain elements that we started to like
[05:31] from the great white shark the teeth
[05:33] that kind of burning intensity of the
[05:34] eyes and then it was almost right what
[05:36] best represents are barreling into
[05:38] physicality like oh just tearing into a
[05:41] room and just breaking everything island
[05:43] bowls and the Rhino came in and then
[05:46] from the Rhino we also really like that
[05:48] kind of hardiness of the skin yeah and I
[05:50] kind of fed into everything that was
[05:52] under the armor we did actually concept
[05:53] under the armor which I think again
[05:55] might be how about I'm hoping is because
[05:57] sharks have that really kind of tough
[05:58] skin as well yes that lovely
[05:59] amalgamation of the two as well yeah
[06:01] that aerodynamic missus the show also
[06:03] with the the haughtiness of her for I
[06:05] know and then it came into as it always
[06:07] does like colors one of the problems is
[06:10] that we use colors a lot in terms of
[06:12] representing symbols you have banner
[06:13] work and all of this like we won't like
[06:15] people differ in the wearing outfits of
[06:17] the gods that you look different from
[06:18] another gods colors but there's always
[06:20] overlapping it's so difficult as we
[06:22] ended up with a kind of Bandos orange
[06:25] orange and green it's tough I think we
[06:29] averaged juice another god I think that
[06:30] we just gonna have to pay polka dot or
[06:32] fuchsia bright neon pink because it said
[06:35] sorry eventually found a little space
[06:37] for him so burn the Beast it's worth
[06:40] talking about the way you've brought him
[06:42] back against armadale I think in house
[06:44] we kind of all thought that maybe band
[06:46] off with lose so this one we were Ronnie
[06:48] yeah it was after seeing the
[06:51] event 1 because in world event one we
[06:52] all thought was a maraca twin yeah that
[06:54] was just not true and so we'd learnt
[06:57] from that how players will side
[06:59] generally with who they see is the good
[07:01] guy and so we all kind of went well out
[07:04] of the two of them band das has more
[07:07] references in game but those reference
[07:09] in game are of him as an antagonist and
[07:12] so he is the bad guy in this as far as
[07:15] you know we can all see so we were
[07:17] fairly sure we dialed up the cornice on
[07:22] band knows you really want him to look
[07:23] impressive and he was impressed
[07:24] oh yeah we did all we could to give him
[07:27] in origin traction making has it kind of
[07:30] viable philosophies sort of thing it's
[07:32] what always were pretty cool too but it
[07:34] wasn't enough in the end of abandoned
[07:36] uploads his background of nobility and
[07:37] just some things that Senator Reagan's
[07:41] you got necessary as well yeah I'm you
[07:42] can look at so many characters Alice
[07:43] Raptor where the no matter where the
[07:46] degree of mystery is really helped a
[07:47] character the fact Amador hasn't been
[07:48] really been around probably also helped
[07:51] but we tried something different with
[07:53] world event to which was to kill the
[07:56] guard at the end of world around yeah
[07:58] and now this kind of split us a start of
[08:01] it to in fact there were several people
[08:03] who contentious issue it was reading
[08:04] attention you knows still I think if you
[08:09] took a vote now I think probably people
[08:10] would have voted to you not yet he'll
[08:12] ban doors but you have to look at it I
[08:15] mean to be the devil's Africa I'm
[08:17] probably on that side to it the devil
[08:18] advocate the sick page needed some blood
[08:21] yeah yeah it needed to show that it had
[08:25] teeth that we meant business the yeah
[08:27] people could die gods could die that
[08:29] there was some threat to it all and
[08:30] there was at least without that kind of
[08:33] slimy thing and in band or his story had
[08:36] effectively been told to ban lost was
[08:38] making time to corporate series when the
[08:40] Goblin series came to a close but at
[08:42] least meant that his storyline had had a
[08:45] kind of close it has a counterpoint pair
[08:46] but sometimes they'd have the valid
[08:47] point that that was the sport on of
[08:49] sanik and and that band offs actually
[08:53] his story was still yet to be told and
[08:54] there was always the threat of our
[08:55] middle yeah it was story not being told
[08:58] at all you know immediately coming in
[09:00] and have been wiped out
[09:01] we've probably paid into the votes in it
[09:02] I think it is
[09:03] yeah and I think that if we're going to
[09:06] do it again and we need to dwell then to
[09:08] to come quickly after world event one
[09:09] but we would probably have told some
[09:11] stories about these two gods beforehand
[09:13] really kind of given a statement it's
[09:15] bedrock hindsight is a wonderful thing
[09:17] yes they'd even still if the decision of
[09:21] how we killed him off was contentious
[09:23] one so the follow-up stories have also
[09:26] been somewhat contentious or at least
[09:28] they've been divisive yeah the mighty
[09:30] fall and of course no matter oh gee now
[09:32] yeah with tying up some of the loose
[09:35] ends like I it's never a bad idea to
[09:39] kill a character as long as the reasons
[09:41] are good yeah and as long as well
[09:42] swallows are good yeah I said something
[09:44] yeah I'm not sure we were quite there I
[09:46] think energy now is started - yeah
[09:49] double down on that and the effect its
[09:53] had on other characters I think is still
[09:55] a good one yes overall I think it suits
[09:58] the bandhas races that a god that
[10:01] represented like kind of if you want
[10:04] something take it you are you know it
[10:06] like power is is it's very strength is
[10:09] equal to e power that leaving a vacuum
[10:12] the hair at the top means that that
[10:15] philosophy becomes really interesting
[10:16] you now got the kind of the or you know
[10:18] Bork and the orgs and everybody fight
[10:21] yeah dominant I think there's maybe more
[10:23] we could do with it yeah I I mean what
[10:25] I've said in the Habeas podcast with
[10:27] like would some of bandura's followers
[10:30] now a few armadillos the the strongest
[10:32] and then join his forces that's a great
[10:34] way Darius now maybe why not be fun to
[10:36] write until it's proven these the
[10:38] strongest so surely there's yeah having
[10:40] some sort of Civil War which was kind of
[10:42] covered by the tournament yeah mighty
[10:44] fall that sore thing I don't think
[10:46] there's enough civil wars happening this
[10:47] year in terms of media let's do it nada
[10:51] yeah you absolutely right and a mighty
[10:53] fall I don't if you know this it's
[10:55] original concept was wildly different in
[10:58] certainly in terms of totin again I was
[11:01] really disappointed that we didn't go
[11:02] for the tone but in hindsight really
[11:04] credibly didn't because it would've been
[11:05] completely mismatched comedy yeah it was
[11:08] got an element of comedy the notion of
[11:10] um a sports movie a kind of a cry
[11:15] style scenario like you're going in and
[11:18] you're in the queen of the early rounds
[11:19] and you've got another friend who's also
[11:21] in the other game montage in game 1 the
[11:24] prototype discussion about how to do a
[11:26] montage yeah and the idea of having your
[11:28] kind of gobbling coaches some of this is
[11:29] still seen a little MIT for you can see
[11:31] the remnants of it like bombing is kind
[11:33] of your coach and you've gone have got
[11:35] zanuck almost participating in the
[11:37] tournament is at the same time but
[11:40] really it was you know the Rockies the
[11:41] karate kids the Mortal Kombat's the
[11:43] street fighters but as a parody and I
[11:46] think that would've been wildly miss
[11:50] that change had turned a response to the
[11:53] cutscenes that we had at Bendel's death
[11:54] because those real quad comedic and I
[11:55] don't think there's maybe not Madonna
[11:57] right I think you're absolutely right
[11:59] also while people weren't supporting
[12:01] badass and we took that kind of like a
[12:02] support for Bandos as singers in it in
[12:04] as an antagonist or seen as comedic
[12:07] that wasn't right whether it was simply
[12:08] they preferred armadyl and actually they
[12:10] still wanted to respect banned oscillate
[12:12] but there was even calls for like a
[12:13] tribute to Gothic style event a year on
[12:15] from an ETF so there was still a sense
[12:18] that it needs to be respected yeah and
[12:20] the end my talk luckily changed into a
[12:22] full point settlement or however you say
[12:24] it one of the mistakes that kind of band
[12:27] or followers make all people poop around
[12:29] to band offices there's no future for
[12:31] band of storylines so we've kind of
[12:32] proven that isn't true absolutely no
[12:35] that was racist and band up so I found
[12:36] us races got a lot to talk about
[12:39] yeah ballast is dead that's probably
[12:41] worth mentioning we were not a big fans
[12:43] bringing back I think we're very much
[12:45] against the idea of bringing because
[12:46] it's why we've done kind of death it's
[12:49] written into the law isn't it in the way
[12:52] the universe works yeah
[12:53] what makes one of God do you know is one
[12:56] and afterlife
[12:57] yeah and so they can all come back yeah
[12:59] and though there are people who still
[13:00] received an axis antagonist but no
[13:02] matter energy did a lot to cut around
[13:04] that often up there I mean do you want
[13:05] to talk it some people want to see in
[13:06] this dialogue so mod Wilson who is a
[13:09] band ASEAN supporter wrote some very
[13:12] very nice dialogue for your conversation
[13:15] with zanuck so if you killed Sonic you
[13:17] can when she asked you how dare you how
[13:19] dare you kill me kind of thing you can
[13:21] we talk with the reasons one of the
[13:22] reason so do you know for band offs and
[13:24] she has a proper go at you because you
[13:26] know basically she thinks
[13:27] Anderson Psychopaths and then the player
[13:30] gets to talk with no actually this isn't
[13:33] fair stop because they're using the
[13:35] strengths of the band off belief gives
[13:37] them in order to become stronger to
[13:40] fight bigger dangers to protect
[13:42] Nuka people there is the idea of you
[13:45] know the weak must be strong you can
[13:46] direct your your fury or your conflict
[13:49] elsewhere and target the right people
[13:51] and my proxy will protect other people
[13:53] so is the idea that gaining strength
[13:55] from the band a symbol ago was a vital
[13:57] way for helping that overcome it um if I
[13:59] don't get a chance I thoroughly
[14:00] recommend reading his des I'm not doing
[14:02] it justice and a great counterpoint to
[14:03] our middle which is you know yeah the
[14:05] weakness or perceived weakness which if
[14:06] I know such a Compaq we're doing them
[14:08] that's great
[14:09] so there we go we have covered band oz
[14:12] next time around we're going to go into
[14:14] more debt gods because why not we've
[14:16] killed a couple this time now we're
[14:18] going to be talking about gothic so
[14:20] please theme tune and now we have mod
[14:23] balance here on the surface with high
[14:24] mod Vance
[14:25] hello mod Matt hey how you doing I'm
[14:27] doing very well and so you're here today
[14:29] to talk about music and what is your
[14:32] favorite piece of music in runescape my
[14:34] favorite piece of music in runescape has
[14:37] to come from actually my favorite quest
[14:39] of all time okay so I guess the
[14:42] listeners can guess what quest it is if
[14:45] I say this on the bit of music is
[14:48] memories of guthix it is absolutely
[14:52] fantastic it's mind-blowing ly good and
[14:54] I understand this may have made you cry
[14:58] a little bit on occasion it was the
[14:59] quest that made me shed a tear or two
[15:02] and then the their kind of score
[15:03] underneath it all just like it breaks
[15:05] your heart as you're going through the
[15:06] thing
[15:07] I don't normally I commit the cardinal
[15:09] sin of space borrowing through quests
[15:11] because I'm like quite keen to finish
[15:13] everything yeah obviously give this mod
[15:15] question you just couldn't do it given
[15:17] my mod name like I have this kind of
[15:18] affinity with with gothics right so I
[15:20] didn't want to rush ahead right and I
[15:22] was absorbing the story and yeah broke
[15:25] my heart and that to this day haunts me
[15:28] and this music itemizes that question
[15:29] standing ok well let's listen to it now
[15:32] and see if you're bluffing more the end
[15:34] lovely
[18:07] well that definitely left tears on mod
[18:10] balances face so now we're off to Mon
[18:12] infinity and the player support team to
[18:14] talk about rules and tools hello and
[18:17] welcome to the latest segment of this
[18:19] week's podcast where custom support I'm
[18:21] mother Finney and I'm joined here by
[18:22] modesty for me Steve yeah hello everyone
[18:25] delighted to be back again for another
[18:26] custom sport podcast it's becoming one
[18:28] of my favorite moments of the week
[18:30] actually other than Senior Day of course
[18:33] silly okay for today it's just me and
[18:34] you Steve and today we're gonna be
[18:36] talking about the rules of runescape and
[18:38] our approach to how we apply them in our
[18:40] game and as well as having the various
[18:41] different tools available to our players
[18:43] helped tailor their own kind of game
[18:45] experience so Steve if you could just
[18:46] talk in a broad sense about you know why
[18:48] do we have rules you know what purpose
[18:50] do they serve yes I mean in most things
[18:53] in life you know you'll find it if
[18:55] you're a school or work or things like
[18:56] that you know there's certain rules that
[18:57] you can't have to adhere to and the kind
[18:59] of general principle is just to make
[19:00] sure that kind of you know it's safe for
[19:02] everyone everyone understands you know
[19:04] where the silk border lines are what
[19:06] what's acceptable and what's not
[19:07] acceptable and so it's really just in
[19:09] that spirit that we have some rules in
[19:11] runescape and we just say look here's
[19:12] some general guiding principles of
[19:14] things which are just you know blatantly
[19:16] unfair which which are just rule
[19:18] breaking or just which are inappropriate
[19:20] and we just don't want in in runescape
[19:22] which is a really you know social and
[19:24] fun environment but but it's live it's
[19:27] on the internet people are interacting
[19:28] with other people so we just have these
[19:30] kind of guidelines in place to make sure
[19:31] that it's like a safe and fun online
[19:33] experience for people yeah it's kind of
[19:36] fostering a healthy community I think
[19:37] that there's some something's really
[19:39] important but that doesn't mean that you
[19:41] know every little bit of rule breaking
[19:42] that we see you know we'll deal with
[19:43] because clearly we saw this at room
[19:46] fester there's very different sort of
[19:47] people that play runescape here so
[19:49] holding young different cultural
[19:50] backgrounds different belief systems
[19:53] different kind of moral standards among
[19:55] players but everyone has this
[19:56] commonality that they play runescape so
[19:59] it's very difficult for us to say this
[20:01] particular type of behavior is against
[20:03] the rules or don't say or do this
[20:04] particular thing because you know some
[20:06] people you fine with that some people
[20:07] don't like it you know everyone has
[20:09] different tolerance levels yeah so what
[20:11] we try and do is just sort of use use of
[20:13] judgment and just say here's a guiding
[20:15] principle of something which generally
[20:16] speaking is unacceptable and if you are
[20:19] concerned about that behavior you know
[20:20] you can
[20:21] use your own kind of player settings to
[20:23] even not see that behavior and not be
[20:25] involved in it or if you're really
[20:26] concerned you could pop up reporting to
[20:28] us and we'll use this of wider sense
[20:29] judgment to just decide whether we need
[20:32] to do something but for the good of the
[20:33] wider community or not mm-hmm all right
[20:36] thanks is that Steve so I want to kind
[20:37] of get on to actual specific rules so
[20:39] we've talked in a broad sense about why
[20:40] we have them and the purpose they serve
[20:42] and but on social media I'm sure you've
[20:44] seen a few yourself and on our forums
[20:46] people ask questions about particular
[20:47] rules and they talk about rules such as
[20:49] gambling or items coming real or trading
[20:51] for instance multiple logging in and all
[20:53] those different kind of rules or not
[20:54] let's Hawkin about lesson questions so
[20:56] it's really if we can can i clarify what
[20:58] our stances on some of these rules so if
[21:00] we can start off with say cheating so
[21:02] using a Mac Pros and that kinda stuff in
[21:04] our game yep I mean we pretty much have
[21:06] a zero tolerance for cheating in terms
[21:08] of using macros or people refer to them
[21:11] as BOTS more common use of what is but
[21:14] you know it's just not fair on other
[21:16] players it's not fair on people that are
[21:17] play the game as intended for somebody
[21:20] else to just you know bot their way
[21:21] through the game there's actually not
[21:23] much satisfaction in doing that anyway
[21:25] you know if you have even achieving
[21:26] ninety nine in a skill or something like
[21:28] that and you didn't actually do it at
[21:30] the time you might think it's a good
[21:31] idea to actually you know get the ninety
[21:33] line that way but when you look back at
[21:34] it retrospectively it doesn't really
[21:36] mean anything to you because you haven't
[21:38] put the time and effort in to actually
[21:39] obtain it's a worthless thing and of
[21:42] course the other thing is a lot of
[21:43] people that use macros and bots they're
[21:45] you know they're doing it not so much to
[21:47] play runescape but more to kind of gain
[21:48] wealth to sell illegally and things like
[21:51] that and it's just not part of the
[21:54] ethics of runescape it's just not the
[21:56] way the game is intended to be plays the
[21:58] social game is supposed to interact with
[21:59] other players you're supposed to you
[22:01] know the more time you invest you know
[22:03] the greater the reward the greater the
[22:04] enjoyment of the game and that's just
[22:06] all undermined by you know bottom macro
[22:08] use so so there's pretty much zero
[22:10] tolerance on that you know if you use a
[22:11] bolt or a macro you know you will be
[22:13] permanently banned in very rare
[22:15] occasions we kind of temporarily banned
[22:17] people and for various reasons where we
[22:19] can see someone is really invested maybe
[22:21] they played for a long long time they've
[22:23] just made one little slip-up one little
[22:25] mistake they're not a hardcore invested
[22:27] gold farmer they're not selling the gold
[22:29] off to real-world trade and things like
[22:30] that and they've just made a poor error
[22:32] of judgment and tiny little bit Mac
[22:34] and we kind of sometimes take that into
[22:37] account and an issue a temporary ban
[22:38] involved in a permanent ban but you'll
[22:40] see the stats that we put on our forms
[22:42] each month and you know the permanent
[22:44] bans and vastly outweighs every band
[22:46] yeah the message really to the listener
[22:48] is you know if you use a bot or a macro
[22:50] you know you will get caught you will
[22:52] get banned might not be the day use the
[22:54] macro might be a little bit later than
[22:55] that but you know it will happen it will
[22:57] catch up with you so it's just not worth
[22:58] it
[22:59] alright thanks Steve some clear advice
[23:01] there as we want to kind of a byproduct
[23:03] almost of obvious botting and cheating
[23:05] which is real we're trading so if she's
[23:06] buying and selling gold for real life
[23:09] money going off and going taking a third
[23:10] pipe websites and things like that so
[23:12] what what's our stance to that how do we
[23:13] deal with that do we deal with it yeah I
[23:15] mean you know to be clear right from the
[23:16] from the outset you know nobody has our
[23:18] permission to sell gold generated in
[23:20] runescape so you know that's against our
[23:22] rules again we have a zero-tolerance
[23:24] approach to it you know we will ban
[23:26] people that roved in there
[23:27] it's a little bit trickier to talk about
[23:29] because we have to use some quite
[23:30] discreet methods and some sort of
[23:31] internal systems and heuristics to
[23:33] identify that stuff so it's a little bit
[23:35] hard for me to talk about how we tackle
[23:37] it you know we are aware of it we're on
[23:39] it we do track these people we do track
[23:42] where the wealth moves around the games
[23:43] you know there's there's people that try
[23:45] and disguise their real-world trading
[23:47] activity by being involved in in duels
[23:49] or dropping stuff to people and think
[23:51] that's kind of covering their tracks you
[23:52] know we're fully aware of all those sort
[23:54] of situations and how the gold moves
[23:56] around and how it ends up with
[23:57] real-world traders and so we are
[23:59] tracking that stuff daily and you know
[24:00] where we identify it and we're certain
[24:03] of it you know and it's yeah people
[24:04] don't need to be worried if your friend
[24:05] gives you a few million GP because you
[24:07] know it's your birthday or something
[24:08] like that you not going to get banned
[24:10] for that yeah people that are banned for
[24:11] real-world trading they know exactly
[24:13] what they're doing they know they're
[24:14] involved in it they might claim
[24:16] differently on our forums they might try
[24:18] and paint a picture of innocence but
[24:19] actually you know we're only tackling
[24:22] real-world trading where we can see it's
[24:24] a real issue you know someone definitely
[24:26] knows what they're doing and they're
[24:27] just not playing runescape they're
[24:28] actually it's that's a byproduct they're
[24:30] just using it as a way to generate money
[24:33] and sell it illegally without our
[24:35] permission and profiting off runescape
[24:38] you know without our permission and
[24:39] breaking the rules and making things on
[24:41] pay for everyone else yeah okay and like
[24:43] cheating there are very rare cases where
[24:45] you know number staff look at on
[24:47] case-by-case basis and they might decide
[24:50] to issue a temporary ban right the case
[24:52] of a player who bought gold a small
[24:55] amount one off a fence is that right
[24:56] yeah I mean again it's very rare the
[24:58] default action really is to permit Lea
[25:00] ban people we do very occasionally apply
[25:02] temporary bans where we can just see
[25:03] this some sort of mitigating
[25:05] circumstances but you know don't rely on
[25:07] that the general principle is it you
[25:09] know if your real world trade and you're
[25:11] going to get Pony Bend all right okay
[25:12] cool thanks first leave so next up is
[25:14] about account sharing offices the rule
[25:17] which prohibits people or you know tell
[25:19] people they shouldn't show their account
[25:20] but why is that there are some comments
[25:21] on social media talking about account
[25:24] sharing happens all the time
[25:25] Jagex don't do anything about it is that
[25:27] true what saw starts towards the couch
[25:28] showing Steve I think account sharing is
[25:31] towards the lower end of rule breaking
[25:33] it's certainly not right at the top of
[25:34] our list of things that were hugely
[25:36] concerned about and in the gaming
[25:38] community and wider outside of runescape
[25:40] just talking about gamers in general
[25:41] it's not that unusual to just kind of
[25:43] share accounts where it causes an issue
[25:46] really is when you enter into an
[25:48] agreement with someone to share your
[25:49] account and then that's all we've good
[25:51] intent you know they say they're going
[25:52] to do a quest for you or something like
[25:54] that
[25:54] but then actually further down the line
[25:56] there becomes issues with with ownership
[25:59] of the account and you know when you let
[26:01] somebody use your account even with this
[26:03] good intent of just doing the small
[26:04] thing for you and then never going on
[26:06] your account again you're allowing that
[26:07] person to basically you know put put a
[26:10] footprint on their account that they've
[26:11] accessed your account so we can see
[26:13] they've logged into it and it looks like
[26:15] they've got a claim to the account it
[26:16] looks like you may have moved to the
[26:18] location where that person is and it
[26:21] just starts to slowly build up a picture
[26:22] that this account isn't entirely secure
[26:24] and then you know you can bet that
[26:26] further down the line there'll be some
[26:27] sort of situation where you know people
[26:29] fall out in real life and they want to
[26:31] sort of caused a bit of griefing and no
[26:33] child I had accessed my friend's account
[26:35] list see if I can get it off them now
[26:36] and caused some damage and you just end
[26:37] up in this sort of situation of conflict
[26:39] where people are arguing over an account
[26:41] and obviously we can we can usually tell
[26:43] who the owner is and side with them but
[26:46] it's a general principle look it's not
[26:48] the worst rule breaking in the world
[26:50] we're not saying go out and do it it's
[26:51] absolutely fine because it does present
[26:53] risks
[26:54] but in terms of all of the rule breaking
[26:56] that could happen in runescape and in an
[26:58] online gaming environment accounts
[27:00] is towards the lower end of it all right
[27:02] cool dead Steve so talking about the
[27:04] count sharing when I talk about account
[27:06] selling this is someone who's built
[27:07] their account and they're looking to
[27:09] sell it on an auction website or trying
[27:11] to sell it to players in game I'll swap
[27:12] it for an account what's our stance
[27:13] towards account selling account Bank
[27:14] yeah we're a lot stronger against people
[27:17] selling accounts that than just sharing
[27:18] their accounts and and that's because
[27:20] it's moved on a bit from look I just
[27:22] want my friend to help me with this
[27:23] question I'm struggling with and I'm
[27:25] gonna share my account it's moved on
[27:26] from there into almost a an agreement a
[27:29] sort of a transaction process you know
[27:31] where something's being exchanged for
[27:32] something you're receiving money or
[27:34] something in build life in exchange for
[27:36] an account it moves outside of runescape
[27:38] it becomes you know there's activity and
[27:40] other sites then passwords start to have
[27:43] to be exchanged people start to sell
[27:45] details of their account along with the
[27:47] account so that the buyer thinks that
[27:49] they think all good claim on it and can
[27:50] continue to recover it yeah that causes
[27:53] loads of problems but of course one of
[27:55] the big issues is that these people who
[27:56] sell accounts and you know they're not
[27:58] that don't have the highest moral
[28:00] standards in the world shall we say and
[28:02] so you know very often their intention
[28:04] is to just recover that account they'll
[28:05] sell the account to someone allow them
[28:07] to play it for a while level the skills
[28:09] a bit put a bit of wealth on it and
[28:10] they'll then simply recover that account
[28:12] back and because they're the owner
[28:13] there's a person that made the account
[28:14] you know they're always going to have a
[28:16] strong claim to that and then of course
[28:18] there's huge disappointment for the
[28:19] person that bought the account firstly
[28:20] they've probably lost some real-world
[28:21] money or something in terms of buying
[28:23] account they didn't put time and effort
[28:24] into the account they then lose the
[28:26] account back to the owner yeah no you
[28:27] know where we can see that pattern that
[28:29] trend happening you know we'll deal with
[28:30] the owner would normally ban the account
[28:31] you know any way to stop it continually
[28:33] being sold but you know my message would
[28:36] be just don't get yourself in their
[28:37] situation if you buy an account it's not
[28:39] your account somewhere some you know
[28:42] down the line maybe not tomorrow but at
[28:43] some point in the future you know
[28:45] there's gonna be a problem with that and
[28:46] we've given a straight choice of siding
[28:48] with the owner or a buyer you know we're
[28:50] going to side with the owner and then
[28:51] you can you lose that account so mmm-hmm
[28:53] advice is don't don't sell again okay
[28:56] all right thanks Steve so let's talk
[28:58] about gambling and play around games of
[29:00] chance and that knesset off there's a
[29:02] bit of confusion certainly on social
[29:04] about what constitutes is this you know
[29:06] do we take action people might see lots
[29:08] of people coming to join sir and Friends
[29:10] chance in Lancaster and our tables
[29:12] matching in regards to the
[29:14] modifying some items in-game to prevent
[29:16] people using it as a mechanism to gamble
[29:18] what's our approach to dealing with that
[29:20] Steve miss whole kind of games of chance
[29:22] or gambling people might refer to it but
[29:24] you know all kind of stemmed from the
[29:27] flower stuff that was kind of happening
[29:28] where you were you would take money on
[29:30] the outcome of the colors that the
[29:31] flowers that would grow and that became
[29:32] quite a widespread thing there was times
[29:35] we'd walk into community areas like the
[29:37] grand exchange would just be covered
[29:38] with flowers and people talking about
[29:40] gambling on flowers so we change that
[29:42] mechanic so that the flowers will grow
[29:44] the same color and then you know we've
[29:46] taken that approach of changing the way
[29:47] that some in-game items work so that
[29:49] they can't be gambled on so for example
[29:52] you know the the phrases spoken by the
[29:54] toy horsey you know we change that so it
[29:55] wasn't a random phrase it was a set
[29:57] phrase we changed the landing position
[29:59] of the starting imp and which map Square
[30:01] would land on relation to the player
[30:03] because that was being gambled on and
[30:05] there always lands in the same location
[30:06] but the thing is that's really just sort
[30:09] of put in the plastron things it doesn't
[30:10] fix the root cause of the problem if you
[30:13] imagine a runescape world that has no
[30:15] items in it at all there's just players
[30:16] and GP and there's not a single item in
[30:19] the game you would say it's impossible
[30:20] to gamble in this game because there are
[30:21] no items to gamble on okay then what you
[30:24] could do is stand in the grand exchange
[30:25] and gamble on the letter of the alphabet
[30:27] of the name of the next person that
[30:29] walked into the grand exchange right
[30:31] unless with no items in the game no
[30:33] clearly that's just unthinkable to do
[30:35] something like that but I'm using an
[30:37] extreme example but I'm just trying to
[30:39] make the point that however much we
[30:41] change and however much we do we've
[30:42] gained content and game items people
[30:45] will find a way through people will find
[30:47] a way to gamble on things and to just
[30:48] change those things it's really just
[30:50] delaying the next thing that will be
[30:52] gambled on yeah it's not effective and
[30:54] it doesn't remove it now the flower
[30:56] thing is gone and that that's create a
[30:58] lot of the spam and disruption that was
[31:00] related to that is gone that's a really
[31:01] good thing and that is one of the
[31:02] driving things I've actually wanted us
[31:04] to do that because it was just becoming
[31:06] very disruptive it was difficult to use
[31:07] a G for its intended purpose because
[31:09] there was lots of this gambling type
[31:11] activity going on now gambling seems to
[31:14] moved into more sort of private
[31:15] locations within kind of clencher to
[31:18] private chats and lots of most public
[31:19] stuff so it's not so visible and it's
[31:21] not causing the spam and disruption in
[31:23] that way so in that sense that it's good
[31:26] now there is a course of risk that where
[31:28] large amounts of money being involved
[31:29] moving around runescape within these
[31:31] gambling communities that that money is
[31:32] going to wind up with the real world
[31:34] traders so that's a real risk and that's
[31:36] something we target I spoke earlier
[31:37] about how we deal with real-world
[31:38] trading and that will pick up those
[31:40] aspects of gambling clans in terms of
[31:42] that wealth ending up with real-world
[31:44] traders so we're kind of satisfied that
[31:46] we kind of got that passed off where the
[31:48] risks deal of risk is that people just
[31:49] lose their stuff you know because they
[31:51] just get scammed or conned by the period
[31:53] that running these gambling things you
[31:55] know it's not the way to make money in
[31:56] runescape you know that there's existing
[31:58] ways to do it through normal game play
[32:00] it's going to be slower and so on but
[32:02] it's it's legit and safe you know if you
[32:03] hang if you're taking a gamble you know
[32:05] the clues in the name you know it's a
[32:07] risk the person could rip you off could
[32:09] just walk away with your money could not
[32:10] play fairly could not explain the rules
[32:13] if the thing that you're gambling on and
[32:14] just take your money and you know
[32:16] frankly if you just avoid it then then
[32:18] it won't be an issue this whole thing is
[32:20] fueled by people wanting to earn money
[32:23] quickly without putting in the normal
[32:24] sort of effort reward ratio thing that
[32:27] makes runescape work and you know if
[32:29] something sounds too good to be true you
[32:30] know it probably is my advice would be
[32:32] just just don't get involved in it we
[32:33] will deal with the real world trading
[32:35] aspects that's fine we're dealing with
[32:37] that I wouldn't risk anything more than
[32:39] you're prepared to lose and I basically
[32:40] wouldn't risk anything at all you in
[32:42] this you know you don't know what's
[32:43] going to happen when you enter this
[32:44] agreement and this particular probably
[32:46] has a good chance anyway they're gonna
[32:48] take your money and walk away in it and
[32:49] if they don't you haven't got much you
[32:51] know come back to that there's not much
[32:53] you can do about it yeah so we're always
[32:54] interested in listening to community to
[32:56] try and fix this sort of thing but as
[32:58] I've explained it's kind of it's a
[33:00] complicated deep arraigned issue and
[33:02] it's not a simple fix you know very
[33:05] often see people say just change this
[33:07] just change the way this works that will
[33:08] fix the gambling problem
[33:10] it's more complexed involved it's not
[33:12] easier I think for people who are
[33:13] gambling or hosting these big chats the
[33:16] risk to them as well that will take them
[33:17] out of the game you know it's not
[33:19] something which one in the game can it
[33:20] has so many negative effects as a result
[33:21] of this kind of gambling so you know
[33:23] we'd always encourage people not to get
[33:24] involved for all the reasons you've
[33:26] mentioned but also you know you could
[33:27] end up getting removed from the game as
[33:29] well yeah I mean if we can see anyone
[33:31] that's involved in gambling large
[33:32] amounts of wealth taking place real
[33:34] world trading involved yeah scamming
[33:35] taking place that sort of thing you know
[33:37] we're going to take acts
[33:39] okay so another rule which players can
[33:40] ask questions about its offensive
[33:41] language especially now I've got the
[33:43] filtering game and that care stuff so
[33:45] what's our stance toward the fencing
[33:47] language is it you know you say the
[33:48] f-word in trouble or is it more severe
[33:50] than that I mean this little comes back
[33:51] to us talking about earlier about
[33:52] tolerance levels and different people's
[33:54] levels of what's acceptable and what
[33:56] isn't there there are some words which
[33:58] are generally pretty much unacceptable
[34:00] and pretty much offensive around the
[34:01] world and those words are ready to our
[34:04] filter list so if you choose to switch
[34:05] on your profanity filter in the game
[34:07] you'll see stars instead of those words
[34:09] that's kind of really clear-cut and at
[34:11] the top and then I suppose there's loads
[34:12] of other types of language and words and
[34:14] things that aren't filtered but you know
[34:16] could potentially be offensive
[34:17] I mean offensive language a sort of
[34:19] default response would be look you know
[34:21] pop someone on ignore if you don't like
[34:23] what they're saying add them to ignore
[34:25] list you won't see what they're saying
[34:27] yeah you know if you walked into a bar
[34:29] or restaurant and there was someone
[34:30] being very loud and and just making you
[34:32] feel a bit uncomfortable because maybe
[34:33] they've had a few drinks and you just
[34:35] felt awkward in that situation you know
[34:36] you could have the option to just move
[34:38] tables or leave the restaurant or go to
[34:40] another bar you know yeah you don't have
[34:41] to sort of you know sit there and listen
[34:43] to it if it was really concerning you
[34:45] know you expect the owner of the bar the
[34:47] restaurant to actually approach that
[34:48] person and do something about it and
[34:50] that's the sort of similar approach in
[34:51] runescape where we're we're the owner if
[34:53] you like and we would step in and wear
[34:54] this clear kind of hate language and
[34:57] really clearly offensive language then
[34:59] we will take action against it but the
[35:01] kind of first stance I think people to
[35:03] say look you know could I just ignore
[35:04] this person will the filter actually
[35:06] stop me seeing this language that I
[35:07] don't like and if those things fail and
[35:09] you're still kind of offensive you still
[35:11] think this person is causing offence
[35:12] within the community get the option to
[35:14] report it to us obviously j-mods are all
[35:17] you know well-adjusted sensible adults
[35:19] that can use good judgement yeah kind of
[35:21] got a good kind of moral compass and
[35:22] we'll just kind of review things and
[35:24] just decide whether it's actually
[35:25] acceptable in there within the runescape
[35:27] gaming community or not all right
[35:28] brilliant thank you so finally Steve you
[35:30] mentioned a few these tools already but
[35:31] can you just kind of recap and go over
[35:33] the tools available for players that
[35:35] allow them to customize their own
[35:36] experience so you can hide your online
[35:39] status that's one that people actually
[35:40] often quite forget about so you can just
[35:42] toggle that on or off and just decide
[35:43] we're doing anyone can see whether
[35:45] you're online or not so that's that's a
[35:47] key one obviously
[35:49] you kind of got
[35:50] channels you can choose whether you
[35:51] won't see your friends or just private
[35:53] chat or just see everyone within all
[35:55] your various chat channels there's the
[35:57] profanity filter that we spoke about so
[35:59] you can kind of stick that on and see a
[36:00] few stars rather than some of the
[36:02] stronger language that you might
[36:03] occasionally see in the game and then of
[36:05] course if if all that fails if you've
[36:06] hidden your online status you've been
[36:08] down the option of maybe ignoring people
[36:09] you know using the profanity filter
[36:11] you've chosen your chat channel settings
[36:13] and you're still seeing something that
[36:15] maybe you're just not very happy with
[36:17] then you have the sort of option to pop
[36:19] a report in to us and as I say that will
[36:20] come in front of a J mod we'll review
[36:23] that situation decide if something needs
[36:25] to be done
[36:26] all right thanks first even that ties up
[36:27] the podcast fetching quite nicely in it
[36:29] we've kind of discussed a load of things
[36:30] why we have the rules and the reasons
[36:33] for that and I think kind of you know
[36:35] the purpose they serve kind of got into
[36:36] detail on some specific rules here and
[36:38] or approach them so hopefully that kind
[36:40] of players are more aware of our stance
[36:43] towards particular things and then can I
[36:45] just end it on that piece about the
[36:46] tools players can use to customize
[36:47] variants there all good stuff and
[36:49] hopefully you guys think I've learned
[36:50] something new or the lady's been quite
[36:52] interesting to take a note here from a
[36:54] male perspective the way we approach the
[36:57] rules of runescape and so if you have
[36:59] any feedback or any comments about this
[37:01] podcast section then do feel free to
[37:03] tweet at that Jagger support we're
[37:04] always listening and looking to prove
[37:05] where we can so for me that's goodbye
[37:07] and Steve yep yes goodbye for me thanks
[37:09] for listening thank you bye bye
[37:10] bye thanks for listening and remember to
[37:13] join the pledge support stream in their
[37:15] first monthly stream next week on April
[37:17] the 19th straight after the developer
[37:19] Q&A they'll be showing you how you can
[37:21] get the most out of our amazing new game
[37:23] client NXT guy
[37:35] you