Transcript of RuneScape Dev Diaries - Mining & Smithing #5: Smithing 101

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[00:00] welcome to the fifth of the money-making
[00:01] technologies are fine gosh this can we
[00:04] talk about smithing and the process of
[00:06] shipping one of the big things for
[00:14] tensioning was we were saying that we
[00:16] wouldn't go beyond certain stones in
[00:17] terms of actually gained yeah we've had
[00:19] a rethink someone point out quite
[00:20] rightly discern stones r NF k training
[00:22] method yeah and if there's an active
[00:23] training method at the st. here you'd
[00:25] expect that to be slightly more
[00:26] experienced and that's a really good
[00:27] point and yeah completely fair so if
[00:29] there is an active training method
[00:31] that's less passive concern stones have
[00:33] the same sort of tear that might have a
[00:34] slightly IRA had any losses but it would
[00:35] be in the same ballpark yeah you know
[00:37] we're not going what that doesn't look
[00:38] 15 again yet if I can see a future
[00:40] expansions actually and the other one
[00:41] was talked about quite a lot was a
[00:43] higher level ores in hard-to-reach
[00:45] places
[00:46] oh yeah it's very hard to reach but in
[00:47] those kind of obscure or less visited
[00:50] places we talked about how they're not
[00:51] going to have quest requirements for
[00:52] example because mining can't depend on a
[00:54] quest to be able you're leveling your
[00:56] show but that a lot of people gave the
[00:57] feedback that they wanted to see them
[00:59] hidden in interesting places and we're
[01:00] not against that no absolutely yeah so
[01:02] we're going to talk about smithing if we
[01:04] could start with how little is changing
[01:06] at least what isn't changing yeah and
[01:08] that is the basic process is making yes
[01:10] you're still going to getting all for
[01:11] mining smelting it yep and then make an
[01:14] interest on manufacture is good yeah and
[01:15] that's not changing at all I think I
[01:16] guess the personal most important big
[01:17] difference is what you do with the items
[01:18] at the end because a big problem we have
[01:20] this missing at the moment is that it's
[01:22] not useful and the most straightforward
[01:24] thing we can do for that is just allow
[01:26] you to blow it up to some more XP yeah
[01:28] so so I make my play body and I've got
[01:30] display body no once it's useless
[01:31] because as loads of them so I just
[01:32] destroy it and get some more XP app
[01:34] however that process might be oh they
[01:35] yeah they make a giant kind of cake body
[01:37] or something yeah or maybe maybe you
[01:39] hand it in to someone's workshop or
[01:41] maybe you just destroy it as a step
[01:42] tackling on a Friday disassembly yeah so
[01:44] we have redesigned what that is but we
[01:46] don't all that's important enough to
[01:47] really go two feet here we can design
[01:48] that a little bit later
[01:49] well I expecting you would get any
[01:50] materials back from that it would
[01:51] destroy the item because there was a
[01:53] part in the process where we're thinking
[01:54] about maybe kind of you get resources
[01:56] back in the year
[01:57] spin that back up into more items but
[01:59] it'd have weird we're in on the gimmick
[02:01] yeah and also kind of eventually
[02:02] management becomes at me I mean you know
[02:03] you're whittling five down to three down
[02:05] to one and yeah do I go get more items
[02:07] it
[02:08] Payne so 40 now worth talking about what
[02:10] the differences are because we're not
[02:11] looking to keep exactly the same no I
[02:14] mean we are we are reworking everything
[02:16] we do want to join gatherings we want to
[02:17] add more to it we can be talking about
[02:18] increased number of mechanics and Livio
[02:20] but we also don't want to go so far out
[02:22] it doesn't feel familiar yeah that's not
[02:24] anybody would change the game should
[02:25] still feel like this menu and to be
[02:26] honest I think like looking at the
[02:28] feedback we've got people like the theme
[02:29] of smithing yeah it feels very kind of
[02:31] tactile yeah it's yeah it's really
[02:33] important for us or someone someone who
[02:34] comes back and does smithing doesn't go
[02:35] what what is this I don't understand
[02:37] where I am they go I'm slipping great
[02:39] yeah just like I did five years ago I
[02:40] can keep something yeah and we don't we
[02:43] don't want to mess that up why do we
[02:44] need to change it at all why do we need
[02:46] more mechanics Internet so the problem
[02:48] with splitting at the moment is we
[02:49] actually have even less mechanics than
[02:50] mining yeah strangely and so actually
[02:53] when we want to give like an improved
[02:54] mining pickles yeah any rewards the
[02:56] range isn't great but there's this stuff
[02:57] we can work with there we can have
[02:58] several remaining picks that do
[02:59] different things we can have adventure
[03:01] boats the duty and things with smithing
[03:03] there really isn't anything going on
[03:04] there's a million and items that makes a
[03:06] long process if you go for smell yeah
[03:08] but really this you know R&J you look at
[03:11] if you look at the smithing rewards in
[03:13] the game they focus on either reducing
[03:16] the materials or giving a rebate on
[03:17] materials or increasing yield because
[03:19] those are really the only things that
[03:20] can change which is why we don't often
[03:22] give smithing reward because there's a
[03:23] no miss lemon analogy to leave us
[03:24] support which we often fail so we're
[03:26] looking to introduce something you're
[03:28] maintaining that familiarity at the
[03:29] moment smithing you've just incredibly
[03:31] fast
[03:31] it just happens probably pick any time
[03:33] at all it's sort of an afterthought
[03:34] there's no timing in it whereas mining
[03:36] for example it takes
[03:38] fairly specific amounts of time to get
[03:39] or so anything you just done and every
[03:41] time it's not more or less instant is
[03:43] when you're doing a huge man which means
[03:44] you can't speed up or slow it down on
[03:46] your water fitting there there's just no
[03:48] mechanics insertion that so we're
[03:49] talking about slowing smithing down and
[03:51] that's going to make people go yeah it
[03:53] sounds like a nerf but that's not what
[03:54] we mean because you can always dial up
[03:56] the XP XP accordingly at the moment
[03:59] making an item
[04:01] and getting XP are the same thing yeah I
[04:03] make an item that process takes one
[04:05] cycle yeah I get XP and I get and I said
[04:07] yeah if we divorce the item from the HP
[04:10] I work on a night and relief quarter of
[04:13] it yeah I get some XP I get some
[04:15] experience makes me and then I get the
[04:16] item yeah we can slow down the process
[04:18] of making the item without necessarily
[04:19] slowing the scale because all numbers
[04:21] going to be changing just the tears
[04:23] coming down to the F that automatically
[04:24] we're going to have to completely
[04:25] rebalance obscure from scratch anyway so
[04:27] we're still gonna have to do all that
[04:28] now yeah but the intention is not to
[04:30] clicky an honor bit but just to
[04:32] make it more interesting that's what
[04:34] we're trying to do so the next part of
[04:35] it which leads what kind of question for
[04:37] you guys which we would want you to help
[04:39] us with is what theme this take your
[04:42] we're going to add more mechanics but
[04:43] how will it feel so we've got three
[04:45] different weeks that we could go down
[04:46] did technically simplest thing to do is
[04:48] to go to the little number in the curve
[04:49] which is how long does it take to make a
[04:50] play body and change it from one mm yes
[04:53] and that would mean you would click and
[04:54] then you would just sit and watch a
[04:56] progress bar go up for a long time into
[04:58] 10 minutes or 20 minutes or something
[05:00] sure and then if you aborted it or got
[05:01] logged out or something hoping for our
[05:03] program you definitely hire again be
[05:04] really irritating so we need to not do
[05:06] that me to do something so from that one
[05:08] idea would be to make it work kind of
[05:09] like how fletching works which is that
[05:11] you assemble individual components now
[05:13] special squads that yeah mate you make
[05:14] the volume in the bowstring you can bind
[05:16] them together but something like that to
[05:17] say I made 200 sword parts or I make a
[05:19] handle and a blade to help yeah exactly
[05:22] and then and then I combined them
[05:24] together into a sort of no it makes the
[05:25] process longer but it would be lots of
[05:27] little pieces they are finished with one
[05:29] finished item now we want mating that's
[05:31] one feel yeah so I assemble the parts
[05:34] I'm gonna make the part yes one item
[05:35] another way of doing it would be that I
[05:37] start essentially with the item perhaps
[05:38] an unfinished sword or perhaps a weak
[05:40] sword and then either work on it some
[05:42] more or I add some more materials and I
[05:45] get a better sword or a more thin every
[05:46] time it's just kind of we are finding
[05:48] and putting maybe it cuts that and can
[05:50] be used each of these individual made or
[05:52] maybe their untradable unusable object
[05:53] yes that just represent the stage of
[05:55] program that's kind of like how it all
[05:56] works
[05:57] yeah times in which you start with one
[05:58] object you add another object to it
[05:59] makes it slightly better in the other
[06:01] object disorders file kind of exactly
[06:03] yeah so I can finish sword so which
[06:05] means it in terms of kind of having a
[06:06] shorthand for this the question like
[06:07] there's a number one is that reflecting
[06:09] I'm not much left number two the
[06:10] herb-lore a kind of like a very kind of
[06:13] if it
[06:14] to make sure we have and the third one
[06:15] the third one is something we haven't
[06:16] really having many other examples in
[06:18] game where it takes say 10 minutes to
[06:21] make a sword yeah so what we do is
[06:23] you're working on your sword and we just
[06:25] store how long sent yeah so I'm going to
[06:27] take a pointing yeah exactly
[06:28] I do we remember that one the sword eyes
[06:30] together you got inventory or perhaps we
[06:32] remember that I'm a player you will have
[06:34] with your making a sword
[06:35] feel free to carry on the advantage of
[06:37] that would be that it would just be a
[06:38] single simple item that you wouldn't
[06:40] have to do anything obviously it's an
[06:43] adventure management man yeah the last
[06:45] items involved but it's also a bit less
[06:47] interesting with less than dad said it
[06:49] feels less like I am making a sword
[06:51] except in progress by I'm watching a
[06:52] loading bar there's probably thing
[06:53] that's worth mentioning at this stage
[06:54] because it sort of touched on it which
[06:56] is that we are planning to de-emphasize
[06:58] the the unnecessary realism in the skill
[07:02] so risk it's gone both ways of death for
[07:05] example the sword can't be used in a few
[07:07] wrap a piece of leather around with him
[07:08] and we're like in real life he would be
[07:09] wrapping otherwise love around it yeah
[07:11] that's then you can feel bits and pieces
[07:12] of that in runescape skills where Elvis
[07:15] would lodger do you have a bit of wood
[07:16] so yeah so a bit of wood is required
[07:18] nobody emphasizing this simulation
[07:20] element but making it feel like a real
[07:21] life because in practice players don't
[07:23] really engage with it very wildly it's a
[07:25] nuisance it requires out of tier objects
[07:27] this requires a different skill I'm
[07:29] trying I level smithing and suddenly on
[07:30] require we're going or crafting or
[07:32] something and so we go to de-emphasize
[07:33] that perhaps even going as far as moving
[07:35] crossbows it deflection is yeah that's
[07:37] something we certainly want to posit
[07:38] with you one of the things that we want
[07:39] to do with mining Smith and rework is
[07:41] move out the crossbow
[07:44] stock element and put that back into
[07:45] fletching because it feels irregular
[07:48] versatile right and that was only in
[07:49] smithing really because it felt like
[07:51] real life it actually makes the game
[07:53] confusing and you're arbitrarily
[07:56] required to level the second skill so
[07:57] make use of the other skill and that's
[07:59] not really your feedback on that is
[08:00] welcome so to go back to the question
[08:02] just kind of round that out yeah if
[08:03] we're looking for how it feels to do
[08:05] smithing you have three options one is
[08:07] the fletching approach does take a
[08:09] multiple items lots of different items
[08:11] to form together to make that finished
[08:13] item second approach is herbal which is
[08:15] to refine a single item I can't revile
[08:17] constantly adding to it this case will
[08:19] be sword or armor constantly refining
[08:21] refining and refining it so you've got
[08:23] that with that optimum item and the
[08:25] third option is a kind of
[08:27] pointing those kind of long-form make X
[08:29] but check pointing some you can actually
[08:31] save your progress of your program we
[08:33] wouldn't expect the difference to have a
[08:35] significant effect on the balancing you
[08:36] hold the rewards or anything like that
[08:38] when it doesn't change the climate hikes
[08:39] or them out of GP or anything like we
[08:41] balance all that yeah one of the biggest
[08:43] things that people talk about like off
[08:44] the back of the initial when we're first
[08:46] on livestream talking about my name
[08:47] smithing and it's still the case now is
[08:49] cold surprisingly popular I know is an
[08:52] favorite go outside of Slayer probably
[08:54] most talked about thing with my name is
[08:55] Yvette yeah so it's understandable
[08:56] people have got large stocks of a so
[08:58] look the economy needs me like like this
[09:00] right I call it throwing a missile on
[09:01] yeah exactly
[09:02] rig drive yes so what are we doing with
[09:03] it what's the plan the plan hasn't
[09:05] changed except that we're going to add
[09:07] something to accommodate everyone yes
[09:09] feedback so the new ORS will have new
[09:11] secondaries yeah so there's a 60 70 80
[09:14] 90 ORS or a new secondary some of the
[09:17] old ORS
[09:18] I think natural adamant Roo night who I
[09:21] have new secondaries so coal will become
[09:23] a low-level yes material that's going to
[09:26] get people yeah going again it is quite
[09:28] important to do that because having a
[09:30] low-level material used at high level
[09:31] causes problems I mean it yes to make a
[09:34] couple of examples because it's used at
[09:35] high level it's priced as if it was a
[09:37] high level material but it's a low level
[09:39] material because that we can gain a
[09:40] Bolton to explode low level players when
[09:44] they're choosing whether to keep their
[09:45] coal or sell their coal yeah it's priced
[09:47] incorrectly for that decision if they
[09:49] don't feeders for the high level account
[09:51] that he finds I mean you find it with a
[09:52] number of things that low level players
[09:53] feel optimal but way of playing go do
[09:55] Runa use the immune essence you know
[09:57] they're now coal and just feeding high
[09:59] level account and that's something we
[10:00] want to really change cuz it's breaking
[10:01] the game and at the opposite end players
[10:03] like Leo di wires or iron men who need
[10:05] to accumulate all to do a high level
[10:07] smithing have to go in mind low level
[10:09] call volume Italy after other methods
[10:11] right but as a low-level material
[10:12] providing low level XP compared to say
[10:14] fourteen ninety or yeah which is what
[10:16] they want to be mining instead of having
[10:18] to mine hundreds of thousands of five
[10:20] yeah to do their tr90 mining again no XP
[10:22] and because their deal wires alright and
[10:24] then they don't have the option to start
[10:25] employing it from nanu Angela is a
[10:26] larger years there are lots of examples
[10:27] of it in-game but using low levels
[10:30] another way that causes profit so this
[10:31] is almost identical to the pitch that we
[10:33] did on the livestream we've got negative
[10:34] reaction but we are accommodating yeah
[10:36] so obviously people lot people have coal
[10:38] so the plan we have to give college
[10:40] is to make it a universal catalyst for
[10:42] all to nothing so at low level it will
[10:43] be a secondary but a high level you can
[10:45] use coal to speed up smithing and this
[10:47] example the kind of thing we get by
[10:48] having this kind of mechanic but if
[10:50] smithing goes faster when I have cold to
[10:52] use then that means coal is always
[10:54] useful to everyone but if you don't have
[10:55] any or you can't afford it you can still
[10:57] do smithing yeah you're just better off
[10:59] with it so that totally will keep a
[11:01] useful cold yeah you feedback so if you
[11:02] welcome on this video case has been
[11:03] driven largely from your feedback on
[11:05] that initial pitch what we don't want to
[11:06] do is I think what some people expected
[11:08] to do which is to have 150 Colby's a
[11:10] secondary to the 1099 if we another
[11:12] volume to secondary there'll be
[11:14] something else something else I'd get
[11:15] through mining up yeah me yeah yeah okay
[11:17] those are probably the core elements of
[11:18] smithing that's worth talking about
[11:19] there are other kind of other cases when
[11:22] we're talking that additional mechanics
[11:23] and smithing that allows us to do more
[11:24] tools detect yes potentially not
[11:26] necessarily for launch agains on the
[11:28] scope and the size of the project
[11:29] obviously we don't want to delay the
[11:30] rework in order to add sniffing tools
[11:32] but but it would allow us to have
[11:33] smithing tools in the same way you
[11:34] currently have mining tools that's
[11:36] relevant both of the sniffing skill
[11:38] itself because maps you can make tools
[11:39] to make you better it's nothing yeah is
[11:40] quite nice but also invention products
[11:42] that sort of thing can have an effect
[11:44] other than what's currently would just
[11:46] be more XP or less materials yeah and we
[11:48] get more interesting it'll be yeah
[11:50] absolutely there might be an element to
[11:51] strategy your loadout management you
[11:53] know what you know going to do
[11:54] individual thing so I think that's good
[11:55] to be oh yeah I already do it give some
[11:56] diversity even if we can't do it that
[11:57] well it's very satisfying to get my
[11:59] dragon hammer yeah
[12:01] he's better than my room on hammer and
[12:02] therefore I can get better yeah that's
[12:04] great yeah it's worth mentioning couple
[12:06] of things that came up in previous
[12:07] videos in case people haven't watched
[12:08] them there's mastery which is kind of
[12:10] took me things yes or we're going to
[12:12] think about that very high level as you
[12:14] Smith more you'll get better estimate
[12:15] yang and that's our attempt to have high
[12:17] level smithing near competitive market
[12:18] both these can be genuinely yet off the
[12:20] board yeah generation GP is largely the
[12:22] aim of mastery and also honed which is
[12:25] bringing components gained by PBM maybe
[12:27] a second particular the plan is that
[12:29] certainly Mel a weapons and armor will
[12:31] be made like Smith's um
[12:33] PV mmm mind components together to try
[12:36] to share some of that profit around
[12:37] between PB
[12:38] yeah just to reiterate a couple of the
[12:40] questions that we have one we do
[12:42] naturally form as a question but I
[12:43] really like Leah to your thoughts on it
[12:45] is it okay to add more mechanics to
[12:47] smithing I mean the outlined our case of
[12:49] our reason for why we develop helps us
[12:51] more reward space more strategy and
[12:53] optimization q as a player but do you
[12:55] actually think that that is okay even to
[12:57] the degree that we're talking about and
[12:59] the other one with those kind of three
[13:00] potential ways of dealing with smithing
[13:02] the selection approach the curb lower
[13:03] approach and the check point to the
[13:05] approach so we'd love your feedback on
[13:06] that and it's also worth mentioning that
[13:07] you know while we may have come to the
[13:09] end of our plan while you're connecting
[13:11] and developer Diaries this isn't the end
[13:12] of the kind of design process and why an
[13:15] smithing we guess what the outstanding
[13:16] problem left over is what's happening
[13:18] with all this side content or exceptions
[13:20] is man's work shall slow my MA and Cole
[13:23] women we just talked about Cole versus
[13:24] probably more to think about what's
[13:25] going to happen when Chris the pigouts
[13:26] as though yeah the controversial issue I
[13:27] have a big document on making based on a
[13:29] lot of player feedback so I'll try and
[13:30] get that up online as soon as I can for
[13:32] people compared to that we're not
[13:33] planning to do a video on that because
[13:35] it is just a huge lift with my said if
[13:37] you get something things yeah we just
[13:38] have to read the gal out and I think it
[13:39] would be a bad format for that so we're
[13:41] gonna do that little document and then
[13:42] the stage after that you've actually get
[13:43] the formal documentation into place the
[13:45] actual design kind of how we did 1215
[13:47] okay I'm not planning to present it as
[13:49] beautifully as you did but but public
[13:51] publicly available documents you don't
[13:53] to be kind of this pumping your version
[13:54] of yourself and an elf closing is that a
[13:57] problem full documents that people can
[13:58] read give feedback fun I mean it'll
[13:59] basically be the same material that
[14:01] we've been presenting here with all the
[14:02] blanks filled in all the details
[14:04] hopefully the balancing numbers although
[14:05] that'll always you subject yes change
[14:07] all the time yeah and then just yeah a
[14:09] lot more meat to guarantee and may well
[14:11] be another developer diary to round up
[14:13] the changes here later and if anything
[14:14] comes up in development or design that
[14:16] we think needs another depth I would
[14:17] definitely hold one and just around out
[14:19] I mean the effect you've had on this
[14:21] morning is missing it's been really
[14:22] design it's been fundamental it's been
[14:24] really worthwhile we seem to be all of
[14:26] it in agreement now yeah and and the
[14:28] direction that money expected going into
[14:29] ocean on the game plan because like
[14:31] we've had we've had to change things
[14:32] roses was enough yeah it's not just a PR
[14:34] exercise we said we want to do this way
[14:36] and we've had people saying no
[14:37] absolutely yes we've gone well again we
[14:39] had never anticipated to get to top
[14:41] levels of smithing that it would cost
[14:42] yeah we actually thought it would have
[14:44] go the other way so that yeah one of the
[14:45] biggest fundamental changes you have
[14:46] thank you very much for everybody's
[14:48] watching these videos and participated
[14:49] in the feedback place yes thank you all
[14:51] would be welcome yeah so remember to
[14:52] give us feedback on those those
[14:53] questions that we have are and thank you
[14:55] very much for watching you've been grant
[14:58] [Music]