RuneScape talk:[Citation Needed]

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RSW Images

What if the only citation I can provide is an image on the RuneScape Wiki? Is there any way to cite that in MLA format, or do I just link to the image? White partyhat old.png C Teng talk 12:17, December 31, 2009 (UTC)

Userbox

This project needs an official userbox. "This user is an active member of RuneScape:Citers' Guild." White partyhat old.png C Teng talk 21:27, December 31, 2009 (UTC)

Is this project called "RuneScape:Citations" or just "Citations"? Or maybe per YG it will be called "WikiGuild Citations".
I created the userbox: Template:Userbox/Citations. White partyhat old.png C Teng talk 21:51, December 31, 2009 (UTC)

Category:References that need verification

Does it need to be checked every month? The website isn't changed that often. White partyhat old.png C Teng talk 02:52, January 2, 2010 (UTC)

Not necessarily. 30 days was just a number I chose that seemed reasonable, it can be changed easily. We could even use different amounts of time depending on the reference (e.g. 30 days for CiteForums, 90 days for CiteGG, etc) if we want. Quest.png Gaz Lloyd 7:^]Events!99s 15:08, January 2, 2010 (UTC)
Okay. Because I don't think things like God Letters and Postbags have ever been changed. White partyhat old.png C Teng talk 17:19, January 2, 2010 (UTC)
they have been changed, but the old URLs redirect to the new URLs. I'm unsure of the whole verification thing after seeing it implemented. I've bugged quarenon to see about a script to make verifying references a one-click deal, and that should hopefully make the whole thing easier. kitty.pngPsycho Robot talkSilver bar.png 04:17, July 21, 2010 (UTC)

Community

How are we supposed to cite things such as black partyhats, server blackout luring, and the Falador massacre? Jagex hasn't addressed them, or if they have, the threads they posted in weren't archived. White partyhat old.png C Teng talk 04:31, January 9, 2010 (UTC)

Simply put, we can't. If there isn't any information on the jagex site, then no citations. HOQSXHBucket detail.pngrwojy 04:35, January 9, 2010 (UTC)
I agree, while its nice to have references everywhere, there's no need to worry about referencing things where references don't exist. However there are non-jagex yet still reputable references out there that aren't affiliated with Jagex, such as Tip.It's interview with Durial 321. kitty.pngPsycho Robot talkSilver bar.png 04:17, July 21, 2010 (UTC)

CitePoll

Should we make a CitePoll template? White partyhat old.png C Teng talk 03:14, January 12, 2010 (UTC)

Is this what it would look like?
Jagex. Halloween Drop. RuneScape Polls. Retrieved 15:11, January 24, 2010 (UTC).
White partyhat old.png C Teng talk 15:11, January 24, 2010 (UTC)
Or maybe we would have a parameter for the poll question, too. White partyhat old.png C Teng talk 15:13, January 24, 2010 (UTC)
Looks good. One of the shorter templates, only 2+date and name parameters. Quest.png Gaz Lloyd 7:^]Events!99s 17:48, January 24, 2010 (UTC)
Wait, we'd probably need a polldate parameter, too, so, with the polldate and question parameters, it would be something like this:
Jagex. Halloween Drop, Halloween Drop. 23 October 2003. RuneScape Polls. Retrieved 21:58, January 24, 2010 (UTC).
Note that the poll title and poll question are the same for this one. White partyhat old.png C Teng talk 21:58, January 24, 2010 (UTC)
Or, like what we do in CitePostbag and CiteGodLetter, we'd do this instead:
Jagex. Halloween Drop, Question 1. 23 October 2003. RuneScape Polls. Retrieved 22:02, January 24, 2010 (UTC).
But we might only need to include the question number if there is more than one question in a poll. White partyhat old.png C Teng talk 22:02, January 24, 2010 (UTC)

Done. Thanks, Gaz. White partyhat old.png C Teng talk 15:29, April 23, 2010 (UTC)

Red asterisk

Template:CiteNPC has, instead of the accessdate, a red asterisk if a reference is unverified. Are we going to be doing that with all the templates? White partyhat old.png C Teng talk 14:59, January 24, 2010 (UTC)

We could if its preferred over the Retrieved -date-. display. I like it, looks a little less cluttered, but it may be less professional. We need more opinions. Quest.png Gaz Lloyd 7:^]Events!99s 17:48, January 24, 2010 (UTC)
I agree that it looks less cluttered, because for the template to work, we need the full "21:56, January 24, 2010 (UTC)". White partyhat old.png C Teng talk 21:56, January 24, 2010 (UTC)
See Forum:Red asterisks for retrieved dates on citation templates. White partyhat old.png C Teng talk 01:09, April 9, 2010 (UTC)

CiteDevDiary

Development Diaries were made before Developers' Blogs, and have no one known author, just Jagex. It would probably look something like this:
Jagex. Summoning: Part 1 - Concept. Development Diaries. Retrieved 15:26, January 25, 2010 (UTC).
I don't think the Diaries have dates, though. White partyhat old.png C Teng talk 15:26, January 25, 2010 (UTC)

You can find most or all of the dates from the RuneScape news archive. White partyhat old.png C Teng talk 17:08, February 19, 2010 (UTC)
Sounds pretty simple. Has it been made yet? If not I'll see about doing it, proably really easy adaptation from Template:CiteDevBlog. kitty.pngPsycho Robot talkSilver bar.png 04:17, July 21, 2010 (UTC)
Some diaries have dates and authors provided, especially later on, I've checked. Anyways I've made it and if there is no author provided we just need to put "jagex" as the author. There is indeed no date but I'm not sure how to address that. We could either make the date not-required, which would potentially let incomplete references pass as complete, or we could make it so the date should be provided, or set to "unknown" which could possibly hide the field altogether. kitty.pngPsycho Robot talkSilver bar.png 04:34, July 21, 2010 (UTC)

CiteSupport

I've created Template:CiteSupport for Customer Support pages. It's pretty much the same as CiteGG. White partyhat old.png C Teng talk 19:37, January 28, 2010 (UTC)

That's a good idea, I hadn't thought of citing things there >_> kitty.pngPsycho Robot talkSilver bar.png 04:17, July 21, 2010 (UTC)

JMod Forum posts

  1. If the post is from Mod MMG, should I put down "Mod Mmg", as it appears in the forums, or "Mod MMG", like how he is better known for?
  2. If a JMod quotes, or whose entire post is written by, another JMod ([1] for example), should I put down the person who wrote the text on the post, or the person who posted it? (For above link, Mod MMG or Mod Mat K?) White partyhat old.png C Teng talk 14:08, January 30, 2010 (UTC)

Lores

Could someone create a Cite template thing for citing Lores and Histories from the KB?? Unicorn horn dust.png Evil Yanks talk 10:55, February 25, 2010 (UTC)

Agreed. White partyhat old.png C Teng talk 02:04, May 20, 2010 (UTC)

Name change

This is very minor, but this is the only project with the "RuneScape:" prefix in its official title. Wouldn't a better name be something like "WikiGuild Citations"? White partyhat old.png C Teng talk 14:35, April 2, 2010 (UTC)

Of course. --Coolnesse 22:57, May 19, 2010 (UTC)

Sounds good to me. HaloTalk 01:05, May 23, 2010 (UTC)
Doesn't make a difference to me kitty.pngPsycho Robot talkSilver bar.png 04:17, July 21, 2010 (UTC)
Most wiki guild names are in the format "Citations Wikiguild". I like the sound of "Guild of Citationous Intent", but I'm not sure many people would appreciate the Venture Brothers reference, and Citationous isn't a word. "Citers' Guild" is a nice pun on Writers' Guild, but its still kind of blah. I'm trying to think of a more creative name that's not too creative. Perhaps a good Wikipedia reference, "RuneScape:[Citation Needed]". But that's still rather strange. I appreciate it but other people might not >_> That's often the case when I have an idea. RuneScape:Refs "Я" Us. RuneScape:Fact Finders. RuneScape:RefScape. I think I'm dangerously imbalanced. kitty.pngPsycho Robot talkSilver bar.png 17:54, July 24, 2010 (UTC)
I love RuneScape:Citation needed. Quest.png Gaz Lloyd 7:^]Events!99s 18:28, July 24, 2010 (UTC)
I think its clever, but your title code doesn't work! Shame on you Gaz. kitty.pngPsycho Robot talkSilver bar.png 19:00, July 24, 2010 (UTC)
My favourites are Citers' Guild and Fact Finders. Just as long as our official name doesn't include RuneScape:. White partyhat old.png C Teng talk 18:04, July 28, 2010 (UTC)

CiteYouTube

I propose having a CiteYoutube. Jagex puts a lot interesting things in their Youtube videos such as the brief appearance of the graphically updated Zanaris and the new graphics effects in the Dungeoneering trailer. Krayfish 14:57, April 17, 2010 (UTC)

Weak Oppose - It would make things easier; however, we don't cite YouTube that often, and we have Template:Cite web. White partyhat old.png C Teng talk 02:03, May 20, 2010 (UTC)

Neutral its not as if we have a space issue here, so it doesn't matter if its used rarely or not. But I don't think youtube videos are often a good source of information that cannot be cited elsewhere. In the example you give, how exactly would the youtube video be used as a source? kitty.pngPsycho Robot talkSilver bar.png 04:17, July 21, 2010 (UTC)

Citation template toolbar

I adapted Quarenon's Template Toolbar script to add a drop down menu of citation templates to the edit toolbar. Try it out! Installation links: Wikia - Monobook kitty.pngPsycho Robot talkSilver bar.png 07:27, July 24, 2010 (UTC)

"Cite something!", very enthusiastic. eCopM0F.png Full Slayer Helmet! Evil1888 Talk A's L Dragon Platebody! 07:45, July 24, 2010 (UTC)
It took all my willpower not to put ", you boob!" after it. kitty.pngPsycho Robot talkSilver bar.png 07:47, July 24, 2010 (UTC)
Awesome, thanks! White partyhat old.png C Teng talk 18:05, July 28, 2010 (UTC)

CiteNovel, or CiteBook

I was wondering if it would be possible to make a template for citing official RuneScape novels/books like Betrayal at Falador and its upcoming sequel, Return to Canifis. I guess would we could also use it for RuneScape - The Official Handbook, although there isn't much to cite there and it's not exactly a novel. The template could include information like the title of the novel, the author, the page number, and the quote being used. What do you think? Quest.png Morian Smith Saradomin crozier.png 22:34, July 29, 2010 (UTC)

Sounds good to me, we could call it "CitePublication" to cover both the handbook, the novels, and any other printed work Jagex produces. I imagine this will be used more than enough to justify the existence. I'll see about putting it together later tonight. kitty.pngPsycho Robot talkSilver bar.png 00:02, July 30, 2010 (UTC)
Awesome, thanks for the quick response. Calling it CitePublication is a great idea, too; that should cover a lot more ground than CiteNovel or CiteBook. I expect I'll be using this quite a bit, so a huge thanks for the help. Quest.png Morian Smith Saradomin crozier.png 00:07, July 30, 2010 (UTC)
Good, but "CitePublication" takes too long to type. White partyhat old.png C Teng talk 13:54, July 30, 2010 (UTC)
CitePub I say! I'll do it eventually! I swears! kitty.pngPsycho Robot talkSilver bar.png 22:10, July 30, 2010 (UTC)

Red asterisks pop up too soon

For most of the citation templates, a red asterisk appears next to the reference after about 30 (or 90 in some cases) days, indicating that the reference should be verified. This seems too short - it's very rare for any of the pages to be changed, especially for archived citations, and causes the unverified references category to get out of control. 120, or even 180 days seems to make more sense. White partyhat old.png C Teng talk 00:57, August 12, 2010 (UTC)

I can't remember if it was something I specifically requested or if it was something Gaz did on his own, however initially I was on board with it because I did not expect Jagex to redirect the old url's to the new ones whenever they changed url formats. They do, however, so I'm not sure if its necessary at all. kitty.pngPsycho Robot talkSilver bar.png 01:00, August 12, 2010 (UTC)
I didn't even know they changed url formats, actually. But, just for checking, let's at least keep the red asterisk for the six months. That would be easy to maintain, and it's worth checking. White partyhat old.png C Teng talk 01:13, August 12, 2010 (UTC)
Well, if you think about it, its not really any easier. It just puts the rush on a time delay. We would have to verify the same amount of references per day whether they popped up 3 months from now or 6 months from now. kitty.pngPsycho Robot talkSilver bar.png 01:16, August 12, 2010 (UTC)

Support - I think it should be 180 days. 1 month is really too much. JOEYTJE50TALKpull my finger 13:16, November 15, 2010 (UTC)

I agree. All i have to say really. Henneyj 15:38, April 7, 2011 (UTC)

It's been 8 months since this was started. RS:BB? Or should I not take this as consensus. It seems like the general consensus its that it's more useful to have a longer verification time. ɳex undique 05:18, April 16, 2011 (UTC)

I've changed them all to 180 days. ɳex undique 06:56, April 24, 2011 (UTC)

Notification for Incomplete References

We have an asterisk to tell when a citation's date parameter hasn't been updated, so is there any way to make it so that a similar thing pops up for any citation missing any parameter? There are a lot of pages in Category:Incomplete references and it gets a little tedious to check every citation to see if it's the incomplete one. On RuneScape, one or more of the citations are incomplete but it would take forever to wade through 60 of them to find it. Would this be hard to do or is it something simple that we should get? ɳex undique 17:00, April 23, 2011 (UTC)

Strong Support - Why didn't we think of this earlier? White partyhat old.png C Teng talk 00:32, April 26, 2011 (UTC)

Unverifyable references

What should I do with references that can't be verified, for example because it is a forum thread that was never archived. Just delete them, replace with some other template, or leave them untouched? Talk to meTHARKONMy adventurer's log 23:10, August 27, 2011 (UTC)

I believe the references would still be valid, as it had once contained the information, but it currently does not (so long as source can still be identified with the date/title etc.). I would recommend just removing the URL if possible. Smithing (talk | contribs) 01:27, August 28, 2011 (UTC)
That sounds good. We should have a parameter for that though, so that if the URL needs to be removed, the page won't be added to Category:Incomplete references. White partyhat old.png C Teng talk 15:17, August 28, 2011 (UTC)

Here's an example page: True skill mastery. I see now there is also an image that can replace that reference on that page, but I'll leave the reference in as an example for now. Talk to meTHARKONMy adventurer's log 23:12, August 28, 2011 (UTC)

Webcitation.org is down

Currently webcitation is down, getting a 404. Something that should be watched, if this persists a lot of references will be invalid. Talk to meTHARKONMy adventurer's log 21:54, September 1, 2011 (UTC)

It's back up again. Talk to meTHARKONMy adventurer's log 23:53, September 4, 2011 (UTC)

New problem though:

CACHING FAILED

http://services.runescape.com/m=forum/forums.ws?254,255,25,61790243
The caching attempt failed for the following reason: Could not establish the root of the downloaded page. This is most likely caused by a page class which isn't supported yet by WebCite.

In addition I noticed some previously archived forum threads are no longer available on WebCite. [2] Unsure if this is because of a typo made by the original archiver or because the archived page was actually lost. Talk to meTHARKONMy adventurer's log 00:21, September 5, 2011 (UTC)