RuneScape:Events Team/Requests/Temujin96

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Temujin96[edit source]

Hello. I'm Temu, although some of you might know me by my ign (x Samurai x). I've been on the wiki since 2012, and and in the CC since July. I'm fairly active, more so now I have finish my exams. I've been playing off and on since 2006 (more or less continuously since 2011), and I consider myself quite familiar with the game. I can access all minigames etc. Temujin 00:08, November 22, 2014 (UTC)

Discussion[edit source]

What do you think being on the ET involves? Ancient talisman.png Oil4 Talk 00:12, November 22, 2014 (UTC)

From what I gather, it involves coordinating with other members of team in order to organise and host events. Temujin 00:36, November 22, 2014 (UTC)

Oppose - People hardly know who you are. You're never on during prime hours, and honestly, your familiarity with the game (from responses I've seen you make) is very lackluster. MolMan 00:14, November 22, 2014 (UTC)

My timezone is UTC + 11:00, and, despite the fact that most (if not all) members of the ET reside in North America or Europe, there is no specific requirement for users to be on during undefined "prime hours". Temujin 01:14, November 22, 2014 (UTC)
Except for the fat that there's barely anyone on. Events are held for all wiki readers, not just the clan, and some events already have attendance issues. If you're not on during a prime hour for all of RuneScape, you won't be on during events. MolMan 01:18, November 22, 2014 (UTC)
"Except for the fat" Are you saying that all the people fat? Even though they are few in number does not mean that we can find it acceptable to insult them. Jimmies but still rustled.  —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Sly Fawkes (talk) on 01:23, November 22, 2014 (UTC).
Other than your above comment, there's nothing to suggest that I am "never on during prime hours". Temujin 01:30, November 22, 2014 (UTC)
Maybe the fact that I'm on during those hours and I don't see you at all. If you're going to dismiss that statement as an "unsubstantiated claim" just because I don't keep a people watching log, then maybe you're not fit for the type of scrutiny this request requires. MolMan 01:35, November 22, 2014 (UTC)
I'm not outright dismissing your claim as such, but I have strong doubts as to your objectivity and the relevance one resentful user's claim that I am "never on during prime hours". Only have you already engaged in votestacking, and your suggestion that this is all part of the normal scrutiny that such requests entail is questionable at best. Temujin 01:56, November 22, 2014 (UTC)
"Votestacking"? Care to elaborate? MolMan 01:56, November 22, 2014 (UTC)

Hahahahano - I don't wiki much but when I do I hear nothing but bad things about you. I think adding a flawed member to the ET may cause it to self destruct. My jimmies were so rustled by this that I couldn't even login.  —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Sly Fawkes (talk) on 00:50, November 22, 2014 (UTC).

Comment - I have no intention of responding to unsubstantiated claims or hearsay. Temujin 01:14, November 22, 2014 (UTC)

lol k MolMan 01:18, November 22, 2014 (UTC)

More oppose - I'm also concerned with your vindictive nature and the grudges you hold against certain people. Being pointed to RuneScape:Chat/Logs/22 November 2014, I notice some very concerning statements by you.

  • "People hardly know who you are." et al is just the only acceptable format in which he can oppose... Otherwise it consists solely of personal attacks
    Is first off very misled. You're pretty much required to be well-known in the clan to be an ET member. When you're in the clan, I don't see any real friendly participation. That's not to say you're being malicious, it's just you're not active at all.

The second part of your statement along with "What I mean is that I was 99.9% sure that Mol would oppose any nomination concerning myself" shows just how far you take a grudge that you seem to think is mutual. If there were a job you were fit for that you wanted to do, I'd be all for it. This, however, is not something you're fit for. Above all, I don't hate you. I don't have any sort of grudge. I'm not out to get you. I don't think it's fair for you to paint me as a vindictive Temu-hater just because I have an opinion of you that you dislike. MolMan 01:51, November 22, 2014 (UTC)

To elaborate on 'well known in the clan' [I'm sure this is what is meant by 'pretty much required']: I wouldn't say being well known in the clan a hard requirement, its just that in reality being 'well known in the clan' is the most reliable way for most commenters to know you and thus be able to judge the guidelines (on RS:ET/R). S:C and IRC would also work but in the past it has usually been the clan. Quest.png Gaz Lloyd 7:^]Events!99s 02:10, November 22, 2014 (UTC)
It is rather ironic that you describe me as vindictive. Firstly, I was referring to your description of me as "a stain on the wiki". Secondly, I don't hold a grudge against you, but when someone has reported frequently ranted about you "being a retard" in PMs with others users, has caused otherwise uninvolved users (such as Sly Fawkes) to "hear nothing but bad things about you", and has described you as a "stain on the wiki", has claimed that past UTP violations were simply them "telling it how it is", you don't exactly get the impression that they "don't have any sort of grudge". In fact, one could be excused for thing thinking that the opposite is true. Thirdly, I don't "dislike your opinion" as such, but do wish that your arguments were more elaborate than my friends and I don't know you, therefore "people hardly know who you are"; I never communicate or interact you at all as a result of my past harassment of you, therefore "you're never on during prime hours". Temujin 02:18, November 22, 2014 (UTC)
I never called you a stain, what are you talking about? Also I don't speak to Fawkes very often, so he never heard anything from me. Maybe I'm not the problem as you'd so very much like me to be. Also, I have no friends. So when I say people don't know you well, I'm talking about all of the clan. MolMan 02:22, November 22, 2014 (UTC) (line 685, Ryan kept it for Cook). Temujin 02:33, November 22, 2014 (UTC)
That was a typo. I meant to say Stan. MolMan 02:35, November 22, 2014 (UTC)

What do you have to offer the ET? Can you come up with events that people will come to and enjoy? Can you regularly do events at the popular times (according to our survey, most popular times are Saturday > Sunday/Friday, 1700 > 1900/2000/2100 UTC; though what proportion of the responders understood that we wanted UTC responses to that question I don't know)? Experience with hard mode GWD bosses or team bosses? Ability to control/lead a medium/large/huge group of people in-game? Quest.png Gaz Lloyd 7:^]Events!99s 02:10, November 22, 2014 (UTC)

The unusual amount of free time (unlimited) that will be mine until at least March 2015 is arguably my greatest asset at this point in time. In fact, I would go as far as to say that it almost completely negates any hypothetical issues that could arise from my living in a different timezone to all current members of the team.
Perhaps not single-handedly, but I have no doubt that I would be able to work with the other members of the team to do so.
Any time suits until the New Year period, but shortly after that I'll be able to host events at such times again.
Some, although I generally prefer to spend my time slaying.
I've no experience leading a huge group of people in-game, although I have quite a lot of the experience leading a medium/large group of players (my CLF access is arguably the least contestable evidence of this) Temujin 02:49, November 22, 2014 (UTC)
And after March 2015? User talk:ThePsionic.png: RS3 Inventory image of User talk:ThePsionic ThePsionic Special:Contributions/ThePsionic.png: RS3 Inventory image of Special:Contributions/ThePsionic 10:08, November 22, 2014 (UTC)
That is yet to be finalised, but I will presumably have approximately dozen contact hours per week. Whatever happens, I will still be more available than most. Temujin 11:12, November 22, 2014 (UTC)

Strong Oppose - All I've ever seen from you is immature behaviour and petty feuds. I do not trust you in any position of power, even one as lowly as ET member. Ancient talisman.png Oil4 Talk 08:58, November 22, 2014 (UTC)

Can you specify these alleged "petty feuds"? Temujin 11:15, November 22, 2014 (UTC)
The fact that you immediately jumped to the conclusion that Mol is "vote stacking" says enough. Ancient talisman.png Oil4 Talk 13:05, November 22, 2014 (UTC)
I didn't immediately jump to that conclusion, but the fact that Sly Fawkes, a user with whom I had had no prior interaction, posted after just over an hour (having not so much as logged in for nearly ten days is) saying "I hear nothing but bad things about you" is, at best, a remarkable coincidence. Temujin 20:30, November 22, 2014 (UTC)
Fawkes is an incredibly active clan member and former ET member. It's very telling that you have no idea who he is. Ancient talisman.png Oil4 Talk 23:27, November 22, 2014 (UTC)
I know who he is, but I have not interacted with him before. The CC is a largely place and it's absolutely possible to that one might have little to no interaction with those who are not active participants in group conversations. Temujin 02:14, November 23, 2014 (UTC)

Soft oppose - While you might be a good person to host events, the way you treat people is not always as great (see your accusation against Mol, above). The latter to me is a more important factor than whether you can guide people to play a minigame or fight a boss. User talk:ThePsionic.png: RS3 Inventory image of User talk:ThePsionic ThePsionic Special:Contributions/ThePsionic.png: RS3 Inventory image of Special:Contributions/ThePsionic 13:15, November 22, 2014 (UTC)

Neutral, leaning oppose - I haven't seen you enough in-game to judge whether you'd be good on the ET, but based off what I've seen on the Wiki I am leaning towards oppose. -- Megadog14Talk 16:50, November 22, 2014 (UTC)

Also elaborating on 'well known in the clan' - I had never joined the clan chat prior to becoming a member of the ET. In fact, Temu is more known than I was when I joined. It's not about who you know, it's about how good you will be at the job. As long as people know enough about you to determine if you are fit for the job, that's all you need. In addition, basing your post off of hearsay is pretty terrible if you don't even know the person. I mean wth?

I Support this proposal, because I think Temu will be able to easily organize and lead events and if he says he can be on during the 'prime times' for many months to come, I see no reason not to support this. Some users find it difficult to get along with Temu during heated or controversial discussions. Being an ET member means you will make and lead events, not have long discussions on politics in the ET clan chat. He doesn't go out and seek arguments like some users here seem to think based off of random things they may or may not have heard from other users who may or may not have ever spoken to him. ._.' Being an ET member is not freaking hard, anyone can do it if they have the time, knowledge and dedication for it, which I believe Temu does. sssSp7p.pngIjLCqFF.png 21:49, November 22, 2014 (UTC)

Being on the ET involves dealing with large groups of people, and things can and do get heated during events. I do not trust Temujin to keep cool. Ancient talisman.png Oil4 Talk 21:53, November 22, 2014 (UTC)
In his arguments he doesn't generally lose his cool from what I've seen. If he ever lost his cool, it was when talking to Mol, and Temu would not be the first one to lose his cool to Mol. I didn't want to bring that up but this herd mentality is infuriating. I don't think the bad things we've seen in S:C will be carried over to the Events Team at all. Working together with people =/= foreign politics arguments. Though ET members do need to keep a level head at all times and deal with trolls/outbursts/etc, like I've said, I think he can handle it.
Even when arguing in S:C, he would stop whenever I told him to, and he understood what he did wrong. He is a very easy person to get along with when the other side is cool-headed and understanding (if another ET member were to call him out on something, I mean). But I don't think that will be a problem anyway. sssSp7p.pngIjLCqFF.png 22:20, November 22, 2014 (UTC)
He started it with baseless accusations. He's also lost his cool with Oil. MolMan 22:25, November 22, 2014 (UTC)
In order to be granted access to the CLF, it is necessary to have a clan that is at least 6 months active and has over 50 members. This is no mean feat as it requires the capacity to deal a large group of players from all walks of life and resolve any disputes or other issues that arise. Whilst not directly related to ET membership, the two roles share many requirements with respect to level-headedness and what have you. Temujin 02:14, November 23, 2014 (UTC)
What he "says" isn't very important. He hasn't been to any event in the past few months. I know that because I either attended them, or I hung out in the fc during the event. If he doesn't even participate in events, how can we know he'll be of any value leading them? You can't just jump back on and say "I can do this guys!" because the truth is, if he never did, what merit does that statement have. A person can't fly just because they say they want to fly. If they've never flown before, they can't just sprout wings and go. MolMan 22:01, November 22, 2014 (UTC)
Because he is an organized person and editor and I think he possesses the necessary leadership qualities. sssSp7p.pngIjLCqFF.png 22:20, November 22, 2014 (UTC)
Then how come he's never shown it by participating in events in any way whatsoever? No one on the current team even knows him, and he seems completely clueless as to how events actually operate. And it's very concerning that someone who has shown 0 interest in events prior suddenly wants to become a huge part of organizing them. MolMan 22:25, November 22, 2014 (UTC)
Regarding my interest in events, I think you'll find that I have demonstrated some interest in events in the past. Furthermore, I have more free time now than I've had for the better part of a decade. Temujin 02:14, November 23, 2014 (UTC)
As I mentioned in passing in the nommessage, I have recently completed numerous examinations. This is, in essence, the sole why I have not attended any events in the past few months. Most people undergoing important examinations tend not to spend much time (if any) playing video games. Temujin 02:14, November 23, 2014 (UTC)
You have 6 edits there. 5 of which were spent making a section called "Killing Mod Infinity". An event to fuel your own hatred against him. Simply having more free time doesn't qualify someone to become an ET member. Especially not you. MolMan 02:16, November 23, 2014 (UTC)
"An event to fuel your own hatred against him."
Funnily enough, Oil4 jumped to the same preposterous conclusion at the time:, JMod killing is a relatively popular event, so much so that Mod Mat K used to stream it on a weekly basis.
Regardless, I'm noticing a pattern here: "I never called you a stain, what are you talking about?" → "That was a typo. I meant to say Stan.", "[he] has shown 0 interest in events prior" → "you have 6 edits there".
"Simply having more free time doesn't qualify someone to become an ET member."
My mentioning of time and exams was largely in response to your arguments that I had not shown, as Fergie stated, that I possess the necessary leadership qualities by attending events. Temujin 04:24, November 23, 2014 (UTC)
There's not a pattern there. You have 6 edits to the suggestion page. 1 was for a minigame, which you are explicitly told not to suggest, and 5 were for a stupid vendetta-filled event. That's not interest. You've never been to an event. I expect anyone who wants to be an ET member to have gone to events in the past frequently. If you didn't have time, then maybe you should wait until you have time, and attend events first. Instead of trying to jump right into the big leagues. MolMan 14:06, November 23, 2014 (UTC)

Question - If you have the necessary leadership qualities and can keep cool during heated conversations, why aren't you doing that here? Ancient talisman.png Oil4 Talk 09:31, November 23, 2014 (UTC)

The circlejerk of "I heard you" and "All I've heard of" is probably just a smear campaign to make him look bad as they haven't really given much proof of their accusations. It wouldn't surprise me that they're trying to make him look like he lost his cool as well. Ozank Cx 19:19, November 23, 2014 (UTC)
It's not a circle jerk or a smear campaign. It's he's done some incredibly stupid and admittedly hilarious things, and they get talked about. Word of mouth spreading bad news naturally, and now it comes up during scrutiny. MolMan 19:51, November 23, 2014 (UTC)
How long ago approx did these "incredibly stupid and admittedly hilarious things" happen? Also can you give some links so I can look at the context and proof myself? Ozank Cx 20:04, November 23, 2014 (UTC)
Do you legitimately think that Mol, Fawkes, Psi, Megadog and I are perpetrating a smear campaign against Temujin? That's laughable Ancient talisman.png Oil4 Talk 20:15, November 23, 2014 (UTC)
With the lack of evidence/links/logs coupled with knowing Mol's relations with Tem from a frontal view, I find it difficult to believe what Mol has said about him being unsuitable unless he provides solid proof, and that probably goes for the rest of you. Anyone can go X sucks and is bad. Until one of you provides proof of your claims I have little to go on. Ozank Cx 20:30, November 23, 2014 (UTC)
Here's a couple examples of stuff we laugh at. Also, I don't have a bad relationship with Temu for no reason. It's bad because I don't like how bad he is. MolMan 20:32, November 23, 2014 (UTC)
Right, so how is it ET related exactly? I don't recall JMods attending RSW events, and hardly see how it's extremely bad. It's not like he's the only one who dislikes certain JMods anyway. If it was an RfCM then it could possibly be relevant evidence but for the things you said about him, I don't see how this little log justifies why he's so unsuitable. Ozank Cx 20:39, November 23, 2014 (UTC)
You should probably read the rest of this request. Where I bring up that 83% of his edits are suggesting an event that's nothing more than Infinity hate fuel (which looks bad for the wiki), and he denies that being the reason. It's obvious that it is. Not everything bad is going to be ET related, because when he does this stupid stuff, we don't go out of our way to think "This makes him a bad ET member huehuehue". I was responding to you saying that this is an unfounded smear campaign. This is just proof that he does stupid things that we laugh about in private. Those are the bad things Fawkes, Tom, and Mega have heard about. MolMan 20:43, November 23, 2014 (UTC)
Making posts on designated threads requesting moderator actions to be reviewed is not an uncommon occurrence on the RSOF. In fact, there is a thread in a public section of the RSOF specifically for reporting questionable forum mod actions. "Specialist forums are overrated tbh" was in reference to the fact that the sole clan dev has been unable to work on clan-related content for most of the year due to their skills being required elsewhere, which has resulted in only a small fraction of planned clan content for 2014 being implemented. Furthermore, I was not citing the CLF as a plus as such, I was presenting the fact that I have access to it as demonstrative of my experience leading a large group of players. The second section of that pastebin was, iirc, said when dealing with a somewhat troublesome user who was eventually kicked by Dtm. Temujin 22:20, November 23, 2014 (UTC)
I'm not entirely sure how I could present my leadership qualities here on an RfET. As for keeping cool during this process, it can be quite difficult to phrase responses in such a way that they are universally interpreted as calm. Due to the inherent lack of prosody (intonation etc.) and body language when communicating exclusively in a written format, a sentence can be interpreted in any number of ways. Of course, this is not normally an issue, but in discussions that are intrinsically scrutinising or inquisitive, it can lead to even the most calm of statements being interpreted by some as aggressive or rash, leading to the perception that the discussion is a heated one. I would like to apologise for anything that I have said earlier in this thread that has been interpreted as less than courteous. Temujin 21:15, November 23, 2014 (UTC)
Me too. I'm sorry ;( MolMan 21:17, November 23, 2014 (UTC)

Support if he keeps up to what he says - Tem gets along with most users well, I have not seen him aggravate others, but sadly I've seen users aggravate him. I'd imagine he'd make a good ET member for RSW as the only users I've seen not get along with him are those who ridicule or have a grudge against him. Ozank Cx 12:56, November 23, 2014 (UTC)

Your support makes no sense. You support now if he does what he says in the future. If he doesn't, are you going to time travel back and oppose? Ancient talisman.png Oil4 Talk 13:12, November 23, 2014 (UTC)
You knew exactly what I meant. I could deliberately interpret other votes in such a way to make them look stupid, but I won't, because I'm above that. And also besides, it makes more sense than running off baseless accusations and rumors. Ozank Cx 13:18, November 23, 2014 (UTC)
I legitimately don't Ancient talisman.png Oil4 Talk 14:10, November 23, 2014 (UTC)
I'm going to assume you legit don't so, it means I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt. Ozank Cx 20:39, November 23, 2014 (UTC)

Neutral - Comment - I don't know Tem well enough to know if he'd be okay. However, if the community supports on balance, then I'd be prepared to step down to make space; I'm not achieving what I hoped to on the ET and another fresh input might be very good. (Though I'd prefer to see a woman join the ET, it's a bit non-representative of all wikians/clan just now.) Quest Icon Crest.png  MarshP  Rune platebody (Guthix) detail.png

Corn is a she Ancient talisman.png Oil4 Talk 18:06, November 23, 2014 (UTC)
This isn't an issue of "balance" the more people the merrier, to an extent of course but we haven't reached that threshold yet, so don't immediately jump to stepping down to "make space." Fawkes  —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Sly Fawkes (talk) on 18:48, November 23, 2014 (UTC).

Weak Oppose When I saw what was going on in this thread, I went through the archives looking for some good questions to ask Tem to bring this back on track. However what I did see is that most RfETs have no drama what so ever, the simple fact that this has all taken place leads me to a conclusion that this RfET should not be successful based solely on the controversy here, which ill admit is a shame, as I don't really know enough about this user to make my own judgement. I've seen his name in the CC a few times but that's it really. Zaros symbol.png KDanger Talk 04:54, November 24, 2014 (UTC)

Edit I forgot to add that his self nomination paragraph leaves a lot to be desired when trying to sell himself to us, compared to such examples as RuneScape:Events Team/Requests/UwS Kamikazi Zaros symbol.png KDanger Talk 05:00, November 24, 2014 (UTC)
I deliberately kept the nommessage brief as I was anticipating questions from the community, such as those asked by Gaz Lloyd above. Temujin 10:15, November 24, 2014 (UTC)
Consensus does not require unanimity, nor is a lack of unanimity a reason for a request to fail. The fact that most past RfETs have, to varying extents, been open-and-shut perhaps reflects more on the requirements of the role than anything else (in this thread alone it has been described as a "lowly [position of power]" by Oil4, and a role that can be done by anyone "if they have the time, knowledge and dedication for it" by Fergie). As for questions, good questions aren't necessarily those that have been asked in previous discussions. Temujin 10:15, November 24, 2014 (UTC)
Kinda-related: most previous successful ET requests (and some unsuccessful) usually express some interest in the role before the request, typically by chatting to me and/or the rest of the ET. I was surprised when I saw this since I didn't realise you were interested (though this could be timezone differences and because I don't use that S:C much). Quest.png Gaz Lloyd 7:^]Events!99s 15:07, November 24, 2014 (UTC)
My question then Temu, If being on the ET is a role that can be done by anyone (per Fergie), then what makes you different from the previous unsuccessful candidates (who per Fergies statement would also have been capable)? Zaros symbol.png KDanger Talk 18:09, November 24, 2014 (UTC)
Perhaps they lacked the time, knowledge and dedication required for the role, which Fergie has said she believes I possess. Looking at Archive 5 alone, Ice Rush12 seems to have had an RfET primarily because their preceding RFR was unsuccessful, it would seem that King kolton9 was thought by some to have had a few behaviour-related issues, and Celestial143 only created their account about eight weeks prior to their RfET. Temujin 06:32, November 25, 2014 (UTC)

Support - Giving someone an opportunity to do a good job on the ET or similar is not something I think people should be so annoyingly fickle towards. Some of the opposes do seem to be carrying a touch of bias and exaggeration. It's important for readers to make their own minds up based on the facts and stay away from the he said, she said side. The candidate is willing and capable so I will support. Ronan Talk 19:02, November 27, 2014 (UTC)

Neutral - I don't have any strong counterarguments other than lack of experience with running events, or being a bit less known in the clan. I haven't seen Temujin express any particular interest in ET-ran events, either. On the other hand, seems that it would be valuable for ET to have a member from slightly different timezone. It's not a problem to give someone a chance. My questions to requesting user: 1. What previously not visited minigame would you suggest for ET to host, and why? 2. What is your idea for a completely new type of an event? 5-x Talk 12:11, November 30, 2014 (UTC)

Closed - There is no consensus for Temujin to join the events team at this time. Quest.png Gaz Lloyd 7:^]Events!99s 22:55, December 5, 2014 (UTC)