Forum:Themed logo and background - updates
Hello, we recently implemented the M&S theme on the wiki (this being the logo and the background). It came to my attention that they were reverted after 1 day because "we only do this for holiday events" so I'm making this thread to figure out if the community minds it being changed for big (huge tbh) updates like the M&S one was.
Theses are what we had in case anyone missed them:
Can we allow the changing of the logos/backgrounds for major updates/events in addition to holidays?12:44, 8 January 2019 (UTC)
EDIT - The light mode image has been changed to better fit since the transition to white on the one shown on this post was too abrupt due to the 2 colours being nearly opposites.
Support -12:44, 8 January 2019 (UTC)
Support - We don’t tend to care about threads for each holiday theme we do, and nobody has disagreed with us doing it. It’s a fun thing to do, and in this case, Mining and Smithing rework is one of the biggest updates of the year and Merds put time into making a custom logo for it. I see no reason why we couldn’t occasionally change our bg and logo when there’s big content updates — it’s fun, people like it, and it’s a welcome change (albeit temporary) to the theme rather than having it look the same for 90% of the year jayden 13:02, 8 January 2019 (UTC)
Support for major updates - it's just a bit of fun innit13:05, 8 January 2019 (UTC)
Support - Per Psi. As long as it's not the discord logo, then I see no harm in making a logo when it's A) done on Merd's own time B) for a big update.13:11, 8 January 2019 (UTC)
Support -16:18, 8 January 2019 (UTC)
Comment - If anyone was wondering, this is what the header and logo was before Iiii I I I reverted it with the reasons Merds outlined. There wasn't actually anything inherently wrong with it jayden 18:14, 8 January 2019 (UTC)
Comment - Given the course of the discussion so far and the somewhat time-sensitive nature of the update, I've temporarily changed the logos to the Mining and Smithing versions for the remainder of the discussion. --LiquidTalk 18:38, 8 January 2019 (UTC)
Support - Is this seriously an issue...19:12, 8 January 2019 (UTC)
Comment - I like the idea of changing up the theme and logo for significant updates. I'm quite happy for the theme to be used for the rework on this occasion. In future I would like theme changes for updates (and holiday events - I don't know where it was decided that those didn't need a formal discussion, but I dislike that idea) to go through a thread. There's always the chance that what looks great to one person is not so great to everyone else (I'm sure most people remember the purple Halloween fiasco we had awhile back). When an update is significant enough for us to want to change the theme this should ideally be part of a more general discussion on how to prep for an upcoming update, for example in this update we ended up not really taking advantage of the opportunity to ask Jagex to help promote the pages we had pre-prepared. We just need to be a bit more organised.20:01, 8 January 2019 (UTC)
- Agreed, there wasn't much time between the moment when I was "asked" to do the logo and the rework taking place, unfortunately. I wanted to start it sooner but there wasn't much interest shown since it was not a seasonal thing and so I didn't bother until someone else brought it up. 20:17, 8 January 2019 (UTC)
- The complaints about the Hallowe'en theme were a result of bad caching on Wikia's part for anonymous users, which resulted in only part of the theme loading (white text on white tables, etc). I don't think anyone had issues with the theme as it was intended to look. 22:33, 8 January 2019 (UTC)
Support - @KelseW: Seems like it is indeed seriously an issue...
Support but I'd prefer not to do this too often, as the cache is a bit fucky and it takes a while for things to return to normal. Maybe two to three times a year, max?22:33, 8 January 2019 (UTC)
Support - and oppose having to go through a thread every time yall propose it be changed // also semi-agree with fetus in regards to not doing it too often (except not to put a hard cap on the number, UCS), e.g. just christmas, halloween, maybe easter, major updates (e.g. menaphos. m&s rework)05:58, 9 January 2019 (UTC)
- Comment - Would creating a forum thread to discuss what actually requires forum threads be okay, or would that be too much forum-threading? Or even too generalised?
- Comment - I think we should since it was 1 of the arguments provided in this discussion. 11:57, 9 January 2019 (UTC)
Create a thread in advance - Temporary site-wide changes should require community consensus and time for people to give feedback on proposed themes. Strongly agree with fetus here about a maximum limit - I'm still on the christmas logo lol. I do like the MS rework theme because I really don't see Jagex having a bigger update this year, but how long would we have it on for? Haidro 13:02, 9 January 2019 (UTC)
Support - When jagex releases an update, maybe large ones only? or something that seems good, it should replace the logo and background with no discussion, that is, if the 2 items are made already. After like 2 weeks, or a month, we can go back to default background and icons15:32, 9 January 2019 (UTC)
Comment - A few things in no particular order:
- Why is the background image in lightmode this instead of the one in the proposal? I can't really tell what it's meant to be from just viewing a content page as a normal reader would.
- I don't really care if the logo has minor alterations made to it, such as the Hallowe'en, Christmas or current logo do. I think we should be careful with changing it significantly so the branding stays consistent on the wiki. However, as there's issues around caching for this and the background (and also for branding purposes), I'd rather keep the changes infrequent. As it happens, holiday events are infrequent so that seemed like a good trigger for temporary changes at the time.
- Similarly, I have no real opinion on background images, but as they suffer with the same caching issues I'd rather keep changes to a relatively small amount.
- We should be careful with changing the theme. We no longer have the issues from the purple Hallowe'en theme since forking, but we're still fixing darkmode issues some weeks after it was released. I don't think we're at a point where we can flip themes around on a whim and probably won't be for some months.
- I'd like to see the process for changing the logo formalised and streamlined as much as possible. Previously, we used to have votes for new logos and themes where other people added their own suggestions. This made it a confusing to resolve.
- Up until now, admins have had carte blanche to do whatever we've wanted with site CSS in the name of getting it ready for the fork and fixing it in various places since then. I don't think it's really an issue, but if people are going to start voting on parts of it then we likely need a proper process for doing so.
Most importantly however, is that this forum does not define what a major update/event is and thus does not solve the problem is seeks to solve. Is it new content, quests or mechanics reworks? Using a single example isn't enough, so it would be good to come up with other examples that we feel were sigificant enough to warrant a theme change. As it stands, 'major' is ambiguous and as such I have nothing to support. cqm talk 17:29, 9 January 2019 (UTC)
- The light mode image was changed mid thread because the transition to white on it wasn't as smooth as it should due to the 2 colours being nearly opposites;
- Agree with the second point, I said this on the discussion we had on the discord, there isn't really a list of rules for keeping the brand like company logos have, I think we could have that if it's really a problem, but so far there hasnt been an issue and you don't see a big number of people risking in this area, so I think things can just be up to whoever's designing the logo to figure out if it's too impactful or not. 23:43, 9 January 2019 (UTC)
Support but after discussion - In the past the wiki theme, and seperately the logo, have been changed a few times unilaterally and I don't remember any community discussion at all on this. We should be more strict on changing the appearance of the whole wiki when it affects everyone. That asides I think this update is a good candidate for a theme change (where the line for a major update is I don't know, but this is over it) and I'd like to see the occasional switchup of the background image and logo at least. -- Cycloneblaze (user - talk - contribs) 00:51, 10 January 2019 (UTC)
Closed - There is (sort of retroactive) consensus to change the logo and background to commemorate the mining and smithing rework. In regards to future updates or events, there is no consensus to allow these without discussion, so per RS:THEME future theme changes for updates or events other than the listed holiday events must be done via a forum. --LiquidTalk 23:57, 24 January 2019 (UTC)