Forum:The Great Convergence

From the RuneScape Wiki, the wiki for all things RuneScape
Jump to: navigation, search
Forums: Yew Grove > The Great Convergence
Archive
This page or section is an archive.
Please do not edit the contents of this page.
This thread was archived on 3 July 2017 by Liquidhelium.

The Great Convergence or what I would call simply, The Translation Project, is a project that will help those that dosen't play RuneScape in english, yes I am aware that fan-site/wiki in others languages do exist but regardless of that we are way more far advanced in term of content and articles than any other fan-site. I think that a sheer amount of others language players use our wiki as it is the most reliable source of information. I'm pretty sure that most people have atleast some basic english knowledge and as a last resort, there is things such as Google Translate. However, in others languages, the names are sometime not the direct translation and/or misleading when compared to english, like in french Plague's End is Le temps des elfes wich directly translate to Time of the Elves wich, have nothing to do with a plague.

The translations would works in two way: others languages redirect to the article and a small table a the bottom in the form of a template that says the subject name in others languages. While grabbing translations from the cache (with list such as this) is relatively easy, we would obviously not be doing every cache Items and NPCS as it would roughly result in 191577 redirects and 63859 page to put a template on. So I think it would be best to ethablish a priority list:

What we should prioritize

  1. Skilling related items/NPCS.
  2. Quest names, items and NPCS.
  3. 'Primary' armour (only normal armour and NOT clue scrolls items).
  4. Titles redirects (unless we already do that?).
  5. Achivements/Completionist cape requirements.

What we should not prioritize

  1. Music Track, as those who listen to RuneScape's music probably listen to it on Youtube or downloaded it with thing as this.
  2. Mini-game related NPCS/items, most mini-games aren't actively played.

For the template, I made a very basic one that should probably be polished, but atleast it does a basic work:

 <div class="infobox-wrapper"; width:0%; display:table;">
 {| class="wikitable lighttable sortable"
 |-
 ! colspan="4" scope="col"|In Others Languages
 |-
 |'''French'''
 |'''Brazilian Portuguese'''
 |'''German'''
 |-
 {{!}}{{{fr|}}}
 {{!}}{{{pt|}}}
 {{!}}{{{ge|}}}
 |}

Example with bucket:

In Others Languages
French Brazilian Portuguese German
Seau Balde Löffel

Note: Not official translations.

We could also use a template where you specifify an item/npc id where it could grab the name automaticly, but honestly I have zero idea if such a thing is feasable. Another idea is that we could link it to otherlangs wiki if a link is specified.

I don't think such a project could 'kill' others languages/wiki as not everyone is necessarily good in english and Translators are sometimes questionables, it would rather benefit everyone and even potentialy incite otherlangs wiki/fan-site to edit their article as there would be more oriented on a subject instead of searching the name of it in-game.

1wDmkih.png  Manpaint of the RPU (t)(c) 16:18, June 27, 2017 (UTC)


Discussion

Oppose - We have other language wikis for a reason, even if some of them are outdated or whatever. We don't need to have a translation for all of the page titles on the wiki that have a cache entry or whatever you're suggesting. We provide translations for titles on their pages because they are sometimes displayed differently and it is more of a courtesy. We are the English wiki for RuneScape, we do not need to cater for all languages, especially in such a huge way as you are suggesting in this thread. jayden 16:36, June 27, 2017 (UTC)

Oppose - Same as Jayden. We have other wikis. I dint see much reason to put more trandlation redirects in right now. - Purple partyhat.png Sparky Kitty the WikianFiremaking.png 16:46, June 27, 2017 (UTC)

Thank you for listening --LiquidTalk 17:01, June 27, 2017 (UTC)

Comment - I don't think it'd be very useful for NPCs or items in most cases, but having it for (mini)quests and minigames should actually be very nice, for those that are interested (e.g. myself), so we could do that, though perhaps not with such a conspicuous table. User_talk:Fswe1 Fswe1 Brassica Prime symbol.png 18:06, June 27, 2017 (UTC)

Comment - I'm not sure, as I don't play RuneScape in another language (since there's no Dutch version :P) I don't know how helpful it could be. Plus the pages on this wiki should have a language link to other language RS wiki's, so people playing RuneScape in that language could click on those. Additionally with the new Wikia header update, the language links are now more prominent (at least in Oasis :P). So if a player would go to the French RS wiki and go to [[:fr:le temps des elfes|le temps des elfes]], they will see a link to the English version called Plague's End and vice versa. Farming-icon.png Salix of Prifddinas (Talk) Prifddinas lodestone icon.png 18:10, June 27, 2017 (UTC)

Oppose - Per jayden, we don't need to sandwich in other wikis just because, despite how outdated they may be. I have to give credit where credit is due, manpaint - Proofreading your forum posts before posting them causes more people to actually consider your ideas. --dDbvitC.pngScuzzy Betahib8CAd.png 18:19, June 27, 2017 (UTC)

Oppose - per Jayden. While I support foreign language wiki efforts and encourage translators to leverage our content on the foreign wikis where helpful, we are not the global/universal RS wiki. Smithing.pngAescopalus talkCrafting.png 18:21, June 27, 2017 (UTC)

Oppose - make otherlang wikis great again User talk:ThePsionic.png: RS3 Inventory image of User talk:ThePsionic ThePsionic Special:Contributions/ThePsionic.png: RS3 Inventory image of Special:Contributions/ThePsionic 18:23, June 27, 2017 (UTC)

Oppose - We have a bunch of such redirects already, so I don't object to an extension to that as an aid for those who are playing a non-english version of the game as they browse the wiki, but documenting the names on different pages does not seem like a good idea. While the english name is unlikely to change, translations can be improved which the vast majority of us would never notice. Redirects are inherently less noticeable if they are incorrect which means we don't really need to maintain them if they do change. cqm 23:32, 27 Jun 2017 (UTC) (UTC)

Support - Hell just froze over. Actually though, I don't really see the harm in this if someone is passionate about it and wants to put in the time to have a bot add all these templates and redirects. (If this is a manual job then oh boy I do wish him luck.) I mean, it's what we have now with the titles and their translations. Redirects are so cheap that does anyone really care if (whatever construction is in French) redirects to Construction? I'm more ambivalent about the template listing translations since I don't really think it's a benefit to the vast majority of our users, but if it's tucked away at the bottom of the page I really don't think it's that big of a deal. Again, this is something that won't hurt the wiki, may have some minor benefit, and so if someone really wants to do it, I don't see the issue. --LiquidTalk 14:35, June 28, 2017 (UTC)

Support all redirects - No reason not to do so, other than minor redirect maintenance concerns. If you feel confident about botting the item translations (and we have a good place to put them -- unclear right now) then maybe go for it, taking advantage of the item ID correspondence (you're welcome!!) ʞooɔ 16:13, June 28, 2017 (UTC)

Support redirects, oppose doing more - I see no harm in having more redirects that redirect the name of what something is called on a foreign language server to the english page name (i.e. the actual/official translation, not the literal translation). Cook (I think?) already made a bunch of redirects like this and I think it goes some way to addressing the problem of people playing in other languages not being able to find the information that they need on other wikis.

Apart from that I don't think that we should be including anything else like translations within pages or links to other language wikis. As other people have pointed out we are primarily a wiki aiming to document english version of the game and doing more than the redirects would involve a lot of additional work that wouldn't really help us achieve that aim and would be better spent on other projects. Magic logs detail.pngIsobelJTalk page 19:06, June 28, 2017 (UTC)

Comment Seeing the comment, especially Cook's I think im gonna repurpose the Great Converge and make it being an 'article template' let me explain, as I mentionned most other lang wiki lack good articles on x subject, so my idea is that we made 'templates' (NOT actual templates) that is basicly the same as the english wiki article but NPC/item/scenery will be remplaced by a number (likely the ID). After we will use a translator to translate the article's phrasing, then we will run a chain find/remplace in notepad++ that will convert IDS to actual cache terms, then web will put pages on respectives wiki (with a proof read needed template). Of course this would be completely optional and will not affect the english wiki in anyway. What do you think guys? 1wDmkih.png  Manpaint of the RPU (t)(c) 19:24, June 30, 2017 (UTC)

Comment - I'll be honest I don't have a clue what you're suggesting here jayden 19:42, June 30, 2017 (UTC)
If you're not proposing changes that affect the English RuneScape Wiki in any way then this thread should be closed, since there is nothing to be approved. You'll need to ask for permission from the foreign language wiki communities instead. And while you are allowed to copy and modify our content under the [[w:Licensing|CC-BY-SA]] license, I doubt you are going to get very good results by simply running it through a translator. --Iiii I I I 19:47, June 30, 2017 (UTC)
Comment Ye, after some test my idea dont seem very much pratical, but i think we should let this thread open a little bit as some people seem to support redirects.

1wDmkih.png  Manpaint of the RPU (t)(c) 00:36, July 1, 2017 (UTC)

I'm sure nobody minds the redirects, you should just do it. jayden 01:04, July 1, 2017 (UTC)

Closed - Redirects can be created if desired. There is no consensus to allow for templates. --LiquidTalk 03:43, July 3, 2017 (UTC)