Forum:Speaking different languages in CC

From the RuneScape Wiki, the wiki for all things RuneScape
Jump to: navigation, search
Forums: Yew Grove > Speaking different languages in CC
Archive
This page or section is an archive.
Please do not edit the contents of this page.
This thread was archived on 22 August 2009 by Azaz129.

I just created a new account on runescape called: Rslang and in that accoun'ts clan you can speak any language you like as earlier today somone was in the clan R S WIKIA and me and frede where speaking in different languages and they told us to stop it or they will report us for speaking different languages. Anyone agree with this before i create the account? Liam - Beta Tester (talk) 10:08, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

Discussion

Support as suggester Liam - Beta Tester (talk) 10:08, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

Comment We should be allowed to speak any language we want ... Forcing someone to speak a 'different' language is kinda racist. FredeTalk 10:27, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

It has nothing to do with race. Zaros tally.PNGBladeQuick chat button.png# 18:22, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

Yea, thats what ya said in chat. is that a support? Liam - Beta Tester (talk) 10:28, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

I Support, we should be able to speak any language we want. FredeTalk 10:33, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for supporting! Liam - Beta Tester (talk) 10:36, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

Support freedom of language choice - With some of the stupid people delve on about in clan chat (it gets bad sometimes) I see no reason why we cant simply allow bi-lingual people to talk in clan chat. You are members of the wikia, and you like speaking your native language.Cap and goggles.pngTEbuddy 11:07, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

Support I'm sure most of us here speak English. But what if that's our 2nd language? What if we're more comfortable with another language? Of course we should be able to speak in another language, I really don't see why not. --Quest point cape.pngLil Diriz 77 Talk Summoning-icon.png 11:22, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

Comment Yea, i am english and german so english is first and german is second. Ja, Ich bin englisch und deutcsh so englisch ist mein first und deutcsh ist second. (As you can see, i spoke loads of german there although it's my second language) Liam - Beta Tester (talk) 12:54, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

Slight support for freedom of language choice - I don't see what's wrong with letting those that speak other languages to speak in the clan chat when there is little to no active conversation with the other members, but if there is an active conversation that is going on, I would prefer those to speak in English. The reason why is that some of us might not know how to speak German, Spanish, or any other language that is different from the native language they speak, and wouldn't be able to converse with those that are talking. ~MuzTalk 14:08, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

As the proposal is now made clear, I will have to say support of a new clan chat to speak in other languages, but we at the regular clan chat will miss all of you. ~MuzTalk 14:30, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

Question - I don't get the proposal. Are you:

  1. Proposing to create a new CC so that users can speak freely? Or,
  2. Proposing that users can speak freely in the existing CC?

  az talk   14:12, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

Azliq, the awnser is your 1st statment. Liam - Beta Tester (talk) 14:29, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

Comment - I think everyone should be able to speak whatever they want. However, this is an English Wiki, and there are RS Wikis in other languages too. I would recommend checking if they have a CC, and if not, try to estabilish one. In regards to several languages without an own Wiki, a multilingual CC operated by RSW would be a good thing. dictature 14:49, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

as this quite succsessful can this be closed early? Liam - Beta Tester (talk) 14:52, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

First of all, I oppose allowing different languages in the clan chat because not everyone can understand you. It isn't really fair if only the people that understand the language you are speaking can participate in the discussion. You don't need an "official" chat to talk in a different language there, so simply go to that new clan chat that you made any time you want to speak another language. Second of all, no, this may not be closed early. All you've had is a few supports. There is no clear consensus yet. Andrew talk 14:55, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

Oppose - per Soldier. No one minds different languages in the official CC as long as it is not spamming and is not to the extremes. There's always PM. Now that's a throwing weapon!Doucher4000******r4000I'll eat you! 15:19, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

Support freedom to speak any language Many of our best contributors here speak English as thier second language, and we fully accept thier contributions. While I understand only English, I can't stand the idea of limiting others because of what our own narrow abilitities are. Its really very very sad that we would impose restrictions on that basis. If you can't understand someone go and learn that language, I promise you that you will not be stopped. The making of more and more rules leads to a destablization, not an increase. It becomes too restrictive to accomplish anything. The less rules we have the better. For any who might say "But what if they are talking about breaking rules?" I say prove it. AGF ftw.--Degenret01 16:10, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

BTW Rswfan, who ever told you to stop was going way past thier authority and they need to be aware of it.--Degenret01 16:12, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

I Oppose a new CC, but support multilingual CC - I support allowing our CC to allow multilingual languages.

Bonziiznob Talk

16:57, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

Dengret, i dont know who it was :( Liam - Beta Tester (talk) 18:14, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

Opponere - imod selv om vi indrømme folk hen til indtale hvilken som helst sprog i den passiar , sig bliver spam. altså , en ny passiar burde finde sted nemlig anden sprogene , ikke sig passiar nemlig al mulig sprog exept engelsk. dvs netop crap.

As you can see, allowing any language to be used is spam to people that cant read it and should not be allowed in the main cc. I do think, however, that a cc should be made for each of the main languages used my wikia members. Making the cc open to all languages = spam to the vast majority of us. This will also make the cc almost impossible to moderate, becuase many of the people with the kicking rights will not know what is being said in the other languages. play it safe and make a new cc for the other languages. Magic-icon.pngStelercusIlluminated Book of Balance.png 18:31, 21 June 2009 (UTC)
And then we will have 4 or 5 ccs with 1 or 2 people in each. Go learn teh language.--Degenret01 18:38, 21 June 2009 (UTC)
if that is the way it would be, then I oppose making any new cc and just allowing english in the main cc. Magic-icon.pngStelercusIlluminated Book of Balance.png 18:46, 21 June 2009 (UTC)
I do not want to see any other CCs open, it will make our main one pretty lonely. But I for one do not fear those speaking that which I do not understand.--Degenret01 18:48, 21 June 2009 (UTC)
this is an english wiki, and so in the cc we should speak english. If you are trying to have a conversation in english and another conversation is going on in german at the same time, the german one is spam and needs to be removed because this is this wiki is written in ENGLISH. Magic-icon.pngStelercusIlluminated Book of Balance.png 18:56, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

Oppose multilingual main CC, Neutral about new CC - I don't really mind if you make a new CC. I am totally against people talking in different languages in the main CC (unless it's only a couple of sentences, or one explains what is said), as not everyone understands it. If everyone would suddenly talk, say, Finnish, I could not understand what they are saying. They might (although it is highly unlikely) say things that aren't very nice. I just don't like the idea of not knowing what someone says in a clan chat for an English wiki.

So just speak English in the main CC, or go to a, say, Finnish CC and speak Finnish there. This would also mean that one should not speak English in a Finnish CC, as people there might not understand it. Ancient talisman.png Oil4 Talk 19:21, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

Comment - If someone speaking another language is bothering you, put them on your ignore list or leave the CC. To somehow claim ownership of the CC is ridiculous, if two other groups of people were also having a conversation, would they need to leave the cc because your having trouble reading through their irrelevant conversation just to continue yours? Why should it be different for someone speaking another language? Cap and goggles.pngTEbuddy 19:32, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

That is something different. If I am having a conversation, and some other people are having one too, I have no right to claim ownership of the CC. It wouldn't really matter anyway, as I would know what they are saying and they would probably not spam up the screen. However, if some people are having a big conversation, completely in a different language, and not I, but multiple people, would not understand what they were saying, then yes, I would think that they should at least explain what the conversation is about. Ancient talisman.png Oil4 Talk 19:47, 21 June 2009 (UTC)
So let me get this straight, you just said "If I am having a conversation, and some other people are having one too, I have no right to claim ownership of the CC", but then you want to tack on to the end "unless they are speaking another language". As you have seen, the users requesting this can and speak english quite well. If theres something they feel they should talk to everyone in the cc about, nothing is stopping them. So to require them to tell you about it seems like a little violation of privacy. Also, why does any language but english instantly become a clutter to your screen? Cap and goggles.pngTEbuddy 20:02, 21 June 2009 (UTC)
If you walk over street, and you hear a bunch of people talking in another language (and you're sure that they are not tourists), wouldn't you want to know what they were saying? Ancient talisman.png Oil4 Talk 07:11, 22 June 2009 (UTC)

Oppose both - Both Rswfan and Frede can speak English quite well, there is no need at all to have their own little conversation in a different language with no one else having a clue what they are talking about. I have yet to see a person in our clan chat that cannot speak English, and they should do so while talking there. Until we have people frequent the CC who can't speak English I see no reason to support. Zaros tally.PNGBladeQuick chat button.png# 20:11, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

Comment - people talking about freedom of speech must be really delusional. Are you saying we should allow people to swear too? Well, then leave all that out of here. If I come into CC and start speaking Russian it will soind like complete spam. This Clan Chat is under the english Runescape Wiki. The other Wiki's are more then welcome to create their own. Hell, people can talk in different languages in this one too, as long as it's not domintating the chat window. Aside from all that, people can always take it to PM's. I see absolutely no reason why anyone would need to come into the clan chat to start speaking in a way incomprehensible by others, unless they are swearing. Now that's a throwing weapon!Doucher4000******r4000I'll eat you! 20:25, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

Comment - We allow people to swear as long as its not directed at someone or used as an insult, the filter takes care of the rest. Regardless, there is no real reason to not allow this except for some weird segregation by language you guys want to enforce. We don't refuse people who are not affiliated with the wiki from clan chat, so where do all these other "well its OUR wiki so your going to speak the language we speak" arguments come from. I just glanced at the clan chat rules [1] and I see no rule against using other languages. Once again, Jagex has given you tools that enable you to never see anyones text you dont like, start using em. Cap and goggles.pngTEbuddy 20:41, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

It's not that I don't want to see them talking, say, Portuguese, but I would like to at least understand what they are saying. Ancient talisman.png Oil4 Talk 20:51, 21 June 2009 (UTC)
That tool is called "Private Message". Clan Chatss are for several people to talk at once. If you want to just talk to one person, PM it is. Purposely talking in a way that people don't understand you is simply unethical, and is against common sense. Now that's a throwing weapon!Doucher4000******r4000I'll eat you! 20:52, 21 June 2009 (UTC)
Unethical and against common sense? Please elaborate. One would think common sense wise, if something is not against the rules and is not harmful, it is permitted. And besides, do you think this is only time an issue revolving multiple languages and the CC will ever come up?. My bottom line is:
  • It is not harmful in any way.
  • Just because you cant understand it doesn't mean its spam.
  • Not against our wiki or CC rules, or Runescape game rules.
  • You can and should utilize the ignore/hide chat options if you feel uncomfortable or think your being crowded.

Cap and goggles.pngTEbuddy 21:13, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

Neutral - I'm not really against a multilingual environment, however, I could see it becoming a moderation nightmare (this is from the perspective of a non-ranked/non-mod player, by the way). How do people quickly recognize rule violations or disparaging comments if its being done in another language? --Quarenon  Talk 22:04, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

Comment - I think assuming good faith plays a big part in that, its not like anyone that speaks a different language is part of an evil conspiracy to break game rules. Cap and goggles.pngTEbuddy 22:12, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

Comment - It's inconsiderate to the other people in the clan chat to speak to someone in a different language when you know, understand and can type english. The 2 or 3 people who want to do this should do it in private instead of spamming up everyone else's chat. Zaros tally.PNGBladeQuick chat button.png# 22:26, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

Comment - Its really getting bothersome for you to assume any chat in any langiage but your own is spam, do you even know what spam is? Cap and goggles.pngTEbuddy 22:50, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

...Yes Tebuddy, do you even see my point or do you just think I am ignorant and close-minded? Zaros tally.PNGBladeQuick chat button.png# 23:41, 21 June 2009 (UTC)
.... Of course not, and I do disagree with you, however I am not being disrespectful. You have yet to define spam for me and just refer to it as anything you don't approve of in clan chat. Your point is that among your own conversation another conversation that just happens to be in a different language also happening at the same time needs to be classified as spam and disallowed. How you can think this way is beyond my level of comphrehension. Cap and goggles.pngTEbuddy 00:02, 22 June 2009 (UTC)

Comment - Some people talk in another language just for fun. I know I've spoken in Spanish to other people in the chat who, like me, take Spanish in school. We mainly say nonsense things like "Tengo monos en mis pantalones" (I have monkeys in my pants) or similar statements. I don't see anything wrong with speaking another language for fun, but I do agree that having an actual, serious conversation in another language should be disallowed. If that is the case, use PM or another clan chat.  Tien  23:47, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

Comment - I really don't see how you can separate those two things based on any criteria. According to you, saying "I have a cat in my pants" in spanish is totally alright and not spam, but saying "hey has anyone here done while guthix sleeps" and someone replying "yes I have done it, why?" in spanish is spam? Cap and goggles.pngTEbuddy 00:02, 22 June 2009 (UTC)

I didn't say anything about spam, but meh. Anyway, "Yo tengo monos en mis pantalones" might be considered spam, but no one has stopped us because of that. It's just for fun. Sometimes, people randomly say "Pie is good," or "I herd u liek mudkipz." It's the same thing really, but only in English. I haven't seen anyone criticize the speakers for spamming. As for your example of serious conversation in Spanish... yes, that is unnecessary. R S Wikia is a chat for speaking English; I mean, we all know that English should be spoken in our clan chat, not another language. There is no reason for someone to ask "Has anyone done While Guthix Sleeps?" in Spanish, and then have a whole conversation about the quest in Spanish when it is obvious that English is the primary language spoken by editors here. If a Spanish Runescape Wiki exists, then shouldn't a primarily Spanish-speaking person just join that wiki (and their chat, assuming they have one)? Usually, those who say random sentences in Spanish in the chat are just doing it for fun; Spanish is not their primary language... like, Chinese is my first language. I say "Zai jian" ("Bye" in Chinese) occasionally, but I don't constantly speak in Chinese when I'm in the chat. I don't think anyone would consider a simple "Zai jian" as spam, but I'm pretty sure people would accuse me of spamming if I blabbered Chinese in the chat when no one can understand it.

Sorry if my reasoning confuses you. :/  Tien  00:45, 22 June 2009 (UTC)

So theres an unwritten rule not included in our clan chat rules that says only english is allowed? Ignoring the fact that you allow spam and other stupid crap in other languages because its fun or everyone thinks its silly, and it remains silly as long as your not seriously asking questions or carrying on a conversation in another language. We should be as hospitable as we can to all users, especially in the case of a foreign wiki which may not see alot of traffic or have any active users at all [2]. I cant think of a reason why we need to defend ourselves from the bad foreigners who want to invade our chat and say mean things behind our backs. Cap and goggles.pngTEbuddy 01:09, 22 June 2009 (UTC)
wait, wait, wait! What is this about foreigners INADING our cc. anyone who is doing something

worthy of the word invade should not be in the cc. Magic-icon.pngStelercusIlluminated Book of Balance.png 01:51, 22 June 2009 (UTC)

Overdramatising the situation for effect. I fail to see how people who do not actually use the Clan Chat would become such experts on how it should be organised. Now that's a throwing weapon!Doucher4000******r4000I'll eat you! 04:34, 22 June 2009 (UTC)
Even though are you totally wrong about my clan chat use and dripping with hostility, my point remains valid. We should not close our channel to anyone that may not natively speak english just because. Once again their chat is not spam, does not violate the wikia, game, or cc rules, and will only bring more traffic. Cap and goggles.pngTEbuddy 05:32, 22 June 2009 (UTC)
Go to any random page and look what language it's written in. That's right: English! This is an English wiki, so people should talk English in the clan chat. Of course there's nothing wrong with talking in other languages a bit, but why complete discussions? If you really want to speak, say, Dutch, just go to the Dutch CC! And if there is no Dutch CC: Make one! Ancient talisman.png Oil4 Talk 07:16, 22 June 2009 (UTC)
In a previous discussion it was decided that because things were one way on the wiki did not mean they were instantly so on the clan chat, for example a user banned on the wiki may not necessarily be banned from clan chat unless they break a clan chat/game rule and needed to be dealt with. So then why because the language is english must everyone speak english or be kicked? And I once again bring up the clan chat rules which conveniently do not discriminate based on language spoken. Cap and goggles.pngTEbuddy 08:33, 22 June 2009 (UTC)
Look, almost everyone here can speak English well. If you're in England, with some English and, say, Russian friends, who all speak English, you don't just speak Russian, do you? That's rude! Just like whispering, as Telos says below. So instead of bothering everyone by speaking a language that nearly no-one understands, why not speak it somewhere where people do not mind? Ancient talisman.png Oil4 Talk 09:39, 22 June 2009 (UTC)
(To Tebuddy): Yes, I do suppose there is an unspoken rule that English is and should be the primary language spoken in our clan chat. It's just common sense, really. Why would you go to an English wiki and speak Spanish? And as such, why would you go to a clan chat belonging to an English wiki and speak Spanish? There are other wikis for other languages. Join them. If you have difficulty speaking English, then why join this wiki in the first place? Like Oliburg said above, conversing with someone else in a different language when everyone else around them is English is rather rude. Imagine you're in the R S Wikia clan chat holding a conversation (in English, obviously). But then, two people enter and start blabbering to each other in another language that no one else understands, interrupting your conversation and making it difficult to read what others have said. Would you seriously not mind that?
As I mentioned before, the occasional silly comment in Spanish is fine... most of the time, everyone joins in anyway. The people who don't join in are usually laughing and asking questions about what they're saying, and the speakers gladly translate their own statements. It's not as rude (if at all), as having an actual conversation in a foreign language. But, that's not my main point, so I don't mind if silly comments in another language are disallowed. My point is clear... per my reasons above and above, I Oppose a multilingual clan chat.  Tien  12:21, 22 June 2009 (UTC)

Oppose multilingual CC, support new one - Many people in favour of a multilingual CC have been recommending that we use the ignore feature. Well, (for example) Frede is a friend of mine and I don't want to have to add him to my ignore list just so that my inbox isn't filled with speech I cannot comprehend. Apparently, Frede and Rswfan were having a private conversation in another language that they could have easily taken to private chat (or one of their own clan chats, if they have no more friend spaces). To other people, the letters and symbols merely seem to be spam. We KNOW that it's actually speech, but it's rather rude to communicate in a public space in a way we cannot understand. It's like how it's rude to whisper to someone in the presence of someone else. By all means, create a new clan chat where you can speak whatever language you feel like, but don't fill up our chat box with what some of us can only interpret at as spam. ~ Fire Surge icon.png Sentry Telos Talk  08:38, 22 June 2009 (UTC)

You need to be real careful with that choice of the word "we" Telos. Because I don't think it is spam just because I don't understand it.--Degenret01 11:30, 22 June 2009 (UTC)

Comment - The CC cannot be equated to a public place, as the CC is moderated, has its own rules, and users to enforce them. Let's assume that the discussion going on in a CC is like a PTA meeting. Now, in this PTA meeting, people are discussing "stuff" in English. Then, a parent starts talking in another language, and the teacher responds in that language. Wouldn't the other parents/teachers feel that they are left out of the dialogue that just occurred between the parent and the teacher. I would.

I have nothing against speaking other languages in the current CC, but it would a common courtesy that the discussions are in English for the benefit of all users. If another user is speaking another language, it is similar to interrupting an on-going conversation. We all know that NOT interrupting an on-going conversation is common courtesy. A non-English word or phrase is acceptable, but an entire conversation? I believe that they should excuse themselves into a corner (i.e. use another CC, private chat, etc.) and continue their discussions there. It would be the more polite thing to do. =)   az talk   12:11, 22 June 2009 (UTC)

Comment - My apologies Degenret, I will slightly reword my closing sentence. ~ Fire Surge icon.png Sentry Telos Talk  17:02, 22 June 2009 (UTC)

Comment - Even though State Parks and playgrounds have a host of regulations attached to them doesn't stop them from being a public place for everyones enjoyment.Cap and goggles.pngTEbuddy 19:26, 22 June 2009 (UTC)

Is this a State Park or a playground? Ancient talisman.png Oil4 Talk 19:38, 22 June 2009 (UTC)
Obviously my point was that because something has rules does not mean it is not open and free. Anyone can make a free Runescape account, join clan chat, and chat way.

I would like to bring up something that hit me last night after I got home late last night. I got onto Runescape, got in clan chat, and noticed there were about four active editors on the wikia who don't happen to speak english as their native language. Now this may come as a shocker, but they were having conversations in their native language while myself and another user were talking fluently in english with disruption. It was really amazing to think that if this gets rejected and someone adds a rule to the cc that says "english only" I would have had to (according to the rules) ask them to stop and eventually get someone on to kick them if they didn't listen.

Tienjt0, as I said before you replied, what if that wiki is no longer being maintained by anyone or not active in the least? You would turn away perfectly legitimate and capable members from both the wikia and the clan chat because they speak spanish better than english? I dont know if you have ever spoken another language fluently, but getting to that step is a huge personal accomplishment and takes months of dedicated training. I would personally consider it a bigger annoyance to have them try and speak english and fail miserably then just let them converse in the language of their choice. Its called freedom, and I dont understand why people are purposefully trying to remove it because they feel threatened or are uncomfortable with words they cant understand.

And can you please stop trying to equate this to a giant public PTA or city council meeting place? This is an open chat channel that anyone can join. When I am in clan chat talking to people and someone makes a comment directed at someone else, I don't jump in and start demanding to know the context in which they are talking about each others lives. Its eavesdropping and nannying, and I don't like participating in it.Cap and goggles.pngTEbuddy 23:59, 23 June 2009 (UTC)

I think what would be a real fail is to allow them to speak there native language while nobody
but a few can understand it, so little it could be comunicated in a pm. Magic-icon.pngStelercusIlluminated Book of Balance.png 00:46, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
Ah, so when people talk to each other and refer to things outside RS and we don't know what their talking about, they must also immediately give a detailed account of exactly what they are saying to one another. Everyone must always understand everything that everyone says. Or we can stop worrying about "omg they might be talking about me". Stop the fear mongering and the hate.--Degenret01 00:52, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
If someone has such poor English that he "fails miserably" when he types, then the guy shouldn't really be editing in the first place... I think I recall a certain user that ran for adminship once, but it received all opposes. The reason? His English was bad.
I'm not threatened or uncomfortable when people speak in a language I can't understand. The reason I oppose this is because it's, as mentioned earlier, rude. I do happen to speak another language (Chinese) fluently (so by no means do I "hate" people who speak a foreign language), and I would never have a conservation in Chinese with someone in the chat when everyone else is speaking English. I would have just brought the conversation to PM.  Tien  01:09, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
Thank you, Tien, that summed it up quite nicely. ~ Fire Surge icon.png Sentry Telos Talk  05:57, 24 June 2009 (UTC)

Comment If creating a separate clan chat keeps languages I can't understand from the main CC then I'm all for it since that is what this thread is about. The only problem then becomes how do you police it? It can only be done by CC admins that can speak the language or else you'll have nothing more then a free-for-all chat sanctioned by this wiki (ok, little exaggeration there but you get my point) and watched over by people that can't speak all of the languages. By limiting the main CC you can at least guarantee that it's being watched over properly by admins or really anybody for that matter. If you are so inclined to have a private conversation in a clan chat that a only a couple people can understand, then it should be taken to a private conversation..it's only common courtesy. I don't mind words or phrases I don't understand thrown in every once in a while (I can swear in numerous languages). Luckily, I haven't been around for any CC chats that I can't understand because if I was I would either leave the chat or just simply put some wikians on my ignore list and I'd never have to worry about their conversations again. Vadanea 09:59, 24 June 2009 (UTC)

Comment I don't believe there needs to be major change to anything in an official manner. The current English formatted Wiki has an English based clan chat. Does this mean wikians cannot speak in another language on it? No. Let's go with common sense here and close this out. If someone chooses to speak continuously in a non-english language on the current clan chat, R S Wikia, a cc admin should request the user or users to take the conversation to PM or what ever other method of communication they so choose. Adding an official alternate language cc is not needed. Not to say any of the wikians can't create something on their own which would be unofficial. Strength-icon.png Hammer2092 Time |KOTA Bandos godsword.png 15:56, 24 June 2009 (UTC)

Propose I would propose a slight adjustment to our current clan chat, R S Wikia, rules. This proposal would help clarify in a little more detail what our community would support as a majority. Add the detail to the existing rules that specifies, " The intent of the wiki clan chat is to speak in English for all major conversations. If at anytime a conversation of multiple lines of dialogue, more than 2 continuous lines per user, occurs in a non-english format the appropriate cc user will be asked to take the conversation outside of the cc or speak in english. Anything 2 lines or less will be deemed acceptable." Strength-icon.png Hammer2092 Time |KOTA Bandos godsword.png 15:56, 24 June 2009 (UTC)

Support multilingual CC, I don't realy have a problem with not understanding everything people say, and I don't think a different language counts as spam. I can perfectly well hold a conversation in English whilst another separate English conversation is going on in the same cc, so why shouldn't I be able to do it with the conversation I'm not in being in a different language, which would be easier to distinguish. As for people breaking other cc rules in the foreign language, surely it doesn't matter as we can't tell. If what is being said in a different language is offending anyone, then they should be asked to stop or speak in a language understood by a rank. --Serenity1137 16:46, 24 June 2009 (UTC)

Comment - I have a question, who exactly is this for anyway? If it is for users that don't know English then wouldn't they be on their language's version of the Runescape wiki? The English wiki is not the same as the wikis in other languages, they have their own community and discussions separate from ours. The clan chat's rules were written in English, and the clan chat was/is created, visited and ran by the English RS wiki. Many chat rooms across the internet have a language rule. Why? Because that is what works. I'm by no means saying "kick bi-lingual people out" and I am not against someone saying the occasional phrase in another language as long as it is not offensive. What I am saying if a few people want to have conversations in another language to be considerate and respectful to the other people in the CC and take it to PM or another CC. Zaros tally.PNGBladeQuick chat button.png# 19:18, 24 June 2009 (UTC)

Comment - The problem with that is the majority of our sister wikis in another language have very little or no activity at all and hence no communities. So when a member of a dead wiki sees our thriving community, they hop over and start editing (as was the case of Hapi007 I believe). Cap and goggles.pngTEbuddy 19:29, 24 June 2009 (UTC)

In reply to your question Blade, I believe this is aimed at people who speak English as a second language, well enough to get by but still no comparison to their native tongue. --Serenity1137 00:10, 25 June 2009 (UTC)

Support miltilingual cc My God! Is the Wiki made of gossipy teenagers? ALl you think when you see someone talk in a language you can't understand is "Oh no! They're talking about me! Omg! I wonder what they're saying" and then basicaly tell them, "Sorry, none of that here. Leave." Is that it? Really? Wow. Imagine if that was you. If you were in a primarily German speaking cc, where your friends were,but you didn't speak german, and they told you to leave or start talking in German, and you're friends wouldn't leave. How would you feel? LIke justice was served? Hmm? Yeah right. You'd be mad that you can't talk any laguage in any cc. Now, you want our cc to do that? Wow. Aren't you just mean spirited. Guthix symbol.pngAm-sayTalk ~ Contribs ~ #Rune longsword.png 05:34, 25 June 2009 (UTC)

By the way, I only speak englsh.
If I didn't speak German, why would I be in a German clan chat?  Tien  12:30, 25 June 2009 (UTC)
As Tienjt0 said, Why would anyone who does not speak German use a German Clan Chat? Same goes here - why would anyone who does not speak english use an english Clan Chat? Aside from irrelevant analogies, there's one simple fact - the Clan Chat is for several people to communicate simultaneously, and a conversation between two individuals that does not concern anyone else in the Clan Chat should be taken to PM's. Now that's a throwing weapon!Doucher4000******r4000I'll eat you! 14:02, 25 June 2009 (UTC)
I don't think this is targeted at people who speak no english at all, but those who speak it as a second language. I know what you are all saying that this is an english cc, but if someone's english isnt too great and they ask for a clarification of a quest guide, I see no problem in them talking for a few minutes in their native tongue to someone who speaks both languages well... --Serenity1137 14:31, 25 June 2009 (UTC)


Comment - This community has a limited supply of administrators and rules that these admins need to enforce to keep the community "in line" so to speak. Why make more work for the admins to manage? KISS - Keep It Simple Stupid. A commonly used term in management of many companies. Let's not overburden ourselves with multiple clan chats for the Wiki. Either support mutli-lingual in current cc or add rules which limit the amount of non-english comminications within the cc as suggested before so this can be decided upon one way or the other. Strength-icon.png Hammer2092 Time |KOTA Bandos godsword.png 21:20, 25 June 2009 (UTC)

Comment - Keeping it simple, here are a two facts: This problem rarely rises. I've never seen anyone have a serious conversation in a different language. Fact two: Unless there are several people joining in, it can be easily taken to PM, and should be as well. Based on those two, I don't think this really needs to be implementeted. Now that's a throwing weapon!Doucher4000******r4000I'll eat you! 22:07, 25 June 2009 (UTC)

Oppose - R S Wikia is for members of the English RS wiki. The french and german and other langual rs wikias should have their own clan chats. And if you can't speak english, what the hell are you doing playing runescape and joining an English clan chat? --— Enigma 06:33, 26 June 2009 (UTC)

Have the same Clan Chat, and Allow All Languages per all. White partyhat old.png C Teng talk 12:20, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

Proposal

It seems obvious that the two sides won't be coming to any a consensus anytime soon, so here's a proposal: Put different languages in same category as Political or Religious discussions. So, people may talk in a different language as long as it is not bothersome to anyone else. If someone feels that it is starting to get in the way of other conversations, then that person is free to ask the people to stop, at which point they can take it PM's or a different Clan chat. I believe that would be advantageous to both sides. Now that's a throwing weapon!Doucher4000******r4000I'll eat you! 05:14, 27 June 2009 (UTC)

Support - A coolio compromise. ~ Fire Surge icon.png Sentry Telos Talk  05:44, 27 June 2009 (UTC)

Support - I'm mainly supporting because I feel we need a consensus here, just hope people don't over react to it --Serenity1137 09:26, 27 June 2009 (UTC)

Support per d4000 Liam - Beta Tester (talk) 10:40, 27 June 2009 (UTC)

Support - >Sounds like a worthy compromise Changed to Oppose. Cap and goggles.pngTEbuddy 11:13, 27 June 2009 (UTC)

Support - A good compromise, will work out for both sides as they got what they both wanted. ~MuzTalk 12:48, 27 June 2009 (UTC)

Oppose This is not a compromise!! Those who can't stand others speaking different languages failed to win their point, but this would accomplish the same thing by them being offended whenever they are in the CC. If you don't like the different language, use the bloody ignore list. Don't try to enforce your beliefs on others. --Degenret01 12:57, 27 June 2009 (UTC)

Believe me I understand where your coming from, someone like this should not in any way regulated by the wiki. However, the ability for the people in the chat at the time to decide whether or not a discussion in another language is disruptive is much better than immediately requesting they stop or leave. As far as legitimate compromises go this is by far one of the better ones I have seen.Cap and goggles.pngTEbuddy 13:13, 27 June 2009 (UTC)
I am 95 percent inclined to agree with you. But I fear that those against the other languages would immediately call it disruption any time it is used. --Degenret01 13:24, 27 June 2009 (UTC)
Its always a possibility, but its just one of those things where you have to assume good faith and hope for the best. But, if I happen to be there when something like this goes down, someone is going to get an earful, and it wont be in spanish. Cap and goggles.pngTEbuddy 13:38, 27 June 2009 (UTC)

Support - per above. Zaros tally.PNGBladeQuick chat button.png# 17:07, 27 June 2009 (UTC)

Slight Support - As long as an explanation about what is said in the other language is given if requested, I do not mind other languages, so I support this. Ancient talisman.png Oil4 Talk 18:43, 27 June 2009 (UTC)

That doesn't fly with me, sorry. If they are bothering you, you may request they take it to pm, but a term of their continued stay shouldn't be that they have to translate everything for you. If its bothering you that much, find out what language they are speaking and plug it in to google translator. Cap and goggles.pngTEbuddy 19:17, 27 June 2009 (UTC)
I meant that they could just say what their conversation is about (For example the new DD of MA) or something. Ancient talisman.png Oil4 Talk 19:58, 27 June 2009 (UTC)
Extremly Confused Comment I left my sign-in saved. I don't think I wrote that. :O But I support the propsal anyways.

Guthix symbol.pngAm-sayTalk ~ Contribs ~ #Rune longsword.png 02:44, 29 June 2009 (UTC)

Support - per all. does this imply that we are allowed to talk about polotics or religion so long as it does not start a flame war?--Magic-icon.pngStelercusIlluminated Book of Balance.png 10:53, 29 June 2009 (UTC)

Support - Sounds good to me. And Stelercus, I do believe we can talk about politics/religion on the clan chat as long as the conversation is kept calm and respectful.  Tien  12:38, 29 June 2009 (UTC)

Support - Yeah, finally we can bring this to an end. Strength-icon.png Hammer2092 Time |KOTA Bandos godsword.png 14:56, 29 June 2009 (UTC)

Support - Sounds good to me.

Bonziiznob Talk

16:55, 29 June 2009 (UTC)

Support - Great ıdea. Epıc support. Ama kımse turkce konusmıyor. --ço¬Ø 08:07, 30 June 2009 (UTC)

Slight Oppose - I've never personally had an issue with different languages before on the CC. If I were on and I did find it confusing and difficult to follow other discussions, there is no way that I would speak up and tell others to either go to PM or another CC..I think it should be up to a CC admin to do that. If I were truly bothered I would PM the CC admin and give my reasoning and then I would hope they would make the request without me having to put myself out there and trying to tell others who are my equal what to do. If there were none around or they felt differently, I would just use the ignore list or leave the chat. If you add this to the same category as politics/religion, then it would need to be opposed because every time I've been on the CC and religion/politics have been brought up, they have been immediately told not to discuss it because it would eventually lead to a flame war. Vadanea 08:59, 30 June 2009 (UTC)

Support/Question - Yes, let everybody speak their mother languages (or father :D if they want to) if they're not good at english and don't want to speak it. Of course there are some mad people like me who speak English much rather than their mother language. And now the question: You said you have just created an account named Rslang and then you said Anyone agree with this before I create this account ? It just doesn't make sense. So if you haven't already created it could it have some other name ? Rslang isn't nice. It should match with our main CC, R S Wikia. Could it be something like R S Lang or R S W Lang ? D-Sheep -T-G-E-H- Summoning 60 21:37, 2 July 2009 (UTC)

Comment yea, i will make it as: R S Lang, has it gone passed the closing date yet? Liam - Beta Tester (talk) 18:21, 3 July 2009 (UTC)

Per RS:CONSENSUS, discussions go on for as long as needed - they have no closing dates.
I agree with this proposal, so long as all other ranks in the CC remember that religious/politcal (and, if this passes, other-language) discussions can go on provided that it doesn't result in flaming, or otherwise large disruption(s), rather than immediate calls to cease it, as I've seen before. Quest.png Gaz Lloyd 7:^]Events!99s 20:59, 3 July 2009 (UTC)

Support multilingual cc why not? It's not fair to restrict languages, and I am speaking as someone who only speaks english. As long as you don't break the rules, speak in any language you want.--User:2+2=4._Probably 14:35, 5 July 2009 (UTC)

Oppose per Degenret and Vadanea. This is not a compromise. White partyhat old.png C Teng talk 12:28, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

Oppose - Per Degenret. FredeTalk 16:08, 13 July 2009 (UTC) Support - I don't really use any other language besides English in the cc, so it really doesn't bother me that I am only allowed to speak English there. I guess allowing users to freely speak what they want is ok, but we are still able to tell them to stop. What concerns me is that people might talk badly towards other people using foreign language. Santa hat.png Powers38 おはようヾ(´・ω・`) 16:14, 13 July 2009 (UTC)

Comment - That's a support for my suggestion... Now that's a throwing weapon!Doucher4000******r4000I'll eat you! 02:59, 14 July 2009 (UTC)
Uh...whoops. o.O Santa hat.png Powers38 おはようヾ(´・ω・`) 03:09, 14 July 2009 (UTC)

Comment - What if people speaking languages other than English think of our English as boring? It's not an English-only game. White partyhat old.png C Teng talk 00:48, 14 July 2009 (UTC)

Comment Any time anywhere in life when people wish to make a rule about something, ask yourself, is this rule just to make things more convenient for me? Or it it necessary to prevent some sort of harm from occurring? If a rule is made/endorsed just because it is more convenient to have it, then shame on you. If you have to work a little harder to allow more people to have less restrictions, then so be it. There should never ever be any restrictions on people just because it is easier on you to have it so. We are a hugely diverse group from around the world and this contributes to our great community. Our differences in all their varieties should be embraced, accepted, tolerated, and even encouraged by all here on this wiki, and on the CC.--Degenret01 09:50, 15 July 2009 (UTC)

Request for closure - this has been going on for a while now, I think we have our consensus. can we close it up now? Magic-icon.pngStelercusIlluminated Book of Balance.png 23:11, 25 July 2009 (UTC)


Oppose - Per Degenret01. Lovely torso armourSupirion1Talk Contribs #Summoning.png 05:32, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

Comment - No consensus has been reached steler. Cap and goggles.pngTEbuddy 09:14, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

Proposal No. 2

Okay, seeing as it's been a month and there's still no consensus, I'd like to offer my idea. I propose that, if a conversation only involves two people for a very long time in any language, including English, take it somewhere else. However, if three or more people are participating in that conversation in the chat, let them stay, because then they're using the chat for its intended purpose. Of course, this means that, for those speaking in a different language, pay attention to whether 3 people are talking after a while, because if it's not in English, fewer people are likely to join the conversation. Butterman62 (talk) 15:12, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

Question - Hm, what about two people who are talking about a certain subject in any language while the rest of the clan chat is silent? That has happened before, and it's not really disrupting the chat or anything because it's only those two individuals who are talking. Should they be asked to take it somewhere else?  Tien  16:02, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

I disagree. Many two-person conversation are ideal to leave open to an audience. And I can't see any justifiable reason not to talk English. User:Vimescarrot 16:14, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

Oppose - as per vimes. Magic-icon.pngStelercusIlluminated Book of Balance.png 21:19, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

Oppose per Vimes. White partyhat old.png C Teng talk 21:51, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

Oppose - this is just out of the blue random. And it's simply unneeded. Now that's a throwing weapon!Doucher4000******r4000I'll eat you! 23:03, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

Oppose per all. AttackJdogy15 TalkDragonfire shield 23:57, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

Closed

Closed - No consensus.--

Helm of neitiznot (charged).png Azaz129 Crystal shield.png Talk Edits Contribs

05:33, 22 August 2009 (UTC)