I am requesting an admin to un-delete the article 24 December, as per the conversation below:
I am interested in why you deleted the content on this page. Yes, the information is about a specific character but that was not the intent of the article, it is Runescape History that a player has received 200M experience in 4 skills, and as an encyclopedia dedicated to RuneScape, we should cover more content then just in game information. Perhaps a revision to dis-include the name, but not the deletion. If you read on other articles, such as 200 million experience you will find information about specific players. Why is this information not removed cause it is player specific. Please un-delete the article and if necessary remove the player's name, and if this is not the case, I will request it from other administrators or complete a vote for un-deletion. Thanks.
P.S. If you are going to delete an article, please complete the task and remove all links to this article as leaving behind Red Links is very unprofessional.
22:40, 30 December 2008 (UTC)
RE: 24 December
Firstly, it'd be rather hard to prove. Secondly, there was a discussion in the Yew Grove a while back about whether or not players need their own pages. Thirdly...I get lazy sometimes. ...I think that's all. WWTDD? 22:48, 30 December 2008 (UTC)
Lazy in not an excuse to not preform your administrative duties. Why would you delete an article and not continue to remove all other pages that contains this article as a link? Please un-delete this article and change what is necessary. It is encyclopedic to RuneScape as history has been made on this day.
22:54, 30 December 2008 (UTC)
- Here is the content from there, we can discuss the relevance of its undeletion or not on a more appropriate forum...
200M in 4 Skills
On 24 December, Gertjaars became the first player to achieve 200M experience in 4 skills. These skills are Cooking, Fletching, Firemaking and Crafting. He also surpassed previous number 1 player, Zezima, for the most experience for a player.
- Frankly, I think the deletion was appropriate and the content needed to go, although it certainly isn't "confidential" or anything radical. There just isn't any need for stuff like this on the wiki. Copy this if you want it, as it will be removed from this page soon enough. --Robert Horning 23:17, 30 December 2008 (UTC)
- From the content, the article qualified as a player article and therefore is subject to speedy deletion.-- 23:24, 30 December 2008 (UTC)
- Comment - But it's not the fact it is a specific player, it's the fact RuneScape History was made. Can't we re-word it the say On 24 December, the first player in history attained 200M experience is 4 skills, being Cooking, Fletching, Firemaking and Crafting. They also attained the highest experience points on a single account. or something like that? It's not about identifying the user, it' about the history of RuneScape that was made.
23:36, 30 December 2008 (UTC)
- Take this discussion to the RS:YG if you want to get some wider input on it. This is not the appropriate forum for discussing this issue. --Robert Horning 04:37, 31 December 2008 (UTC)
- As has been done
The delete seems quite right to me. I have stated before that any mentioning of players in articles could open a door to all sorts of "so what" type information, and here is a great example. Good for Gertjaars, but it is highly irrelevant. It has absolutely no impact on the game, the community, or anything else. --Degenret01 06:50, 31 December 2008 (UTC)
- I'm gonna have to agree with Degenret. It's basically a player article. Andrew talk 06:52, 31 December 2008 (UTC)
- Okay, so let me get this right. Even if I change the article to say On 24 December, the first player in history attained 200M experience is 4 skills, being Cooking, Fletching, Firemaking and Crafting. They also attained the highest experience points on a single account. you don't agree that this is in encyclopedic information about RuneScape. HISTORY was made this day! If we are not going to discuss the importance of RuneScape's history, I propose deleting the Andrew Gower page etc. It has no significance to the game, but it does it's history. Come on people, it's not a player's article. It's all about good intention, and that's what I have. If you guys really don't want it in, fine, I'll drop it, but I think it is important. Honor the history!!!!!!!!
07:12, 31 December 2008 (UTC)
- Lets compare what I said to what you responded to. I said "It has absolutely no impact on the game, the community, or anything else". Your saying we can delete Andrew Gower on the same premise? Really? I think your getting a little worked up man. And yes, even without his name in the article, I do not see it as worth anything.--Degenret01 07:22, 31 December 2008 (UTC)
- There is a major difference between a player achieving a lot of experience in their skills and the man who created the game.-- 07:25, 31 December 2008 (UTC)
*sigh* I was honestly hoping more from you guys and am extremely disappointed. This wikia is about information, not censoring the facts. Okay, if it what you guys want then that is okay with me. You are both trusted editors, respectable sysops and whom intent is and always will be for this wikia. If you feel it is not suitable I will not push it any longer. Note though: RuneScape's history is as important to players, users and fellow editors. Censoring the content of made history just limits this wikia. It's against the policies and procedures to create a player article (though I was trying to make it so it was not one) but in those policies and procedures it states that some things can be hindered to benefit. Prime example being the slang dictionary right. It is not directly related to the game, just an extra for the convenience of the user. RuneScape history is made and charted in the article 200 million experience, and players are mentioned in this article without censorship. Why are some articles allowed this privilege to document but not other when the intent is the same? Please don't respond to this but just think about irony and how consistent this is to the policies and procedures. It's really confusing.
I am going to end my involvement with this Yew Grove discussion. Thanks for your input and look forward to serving this wikia with you in the future.
P.S. I'm looking forward to future discrepancies. They are fun aren't they? :)
07:48, 31 December 2008 (UTC)
- Comment I guess this discussion is over but I'd like to point out that a lot of other date articles have information about players achieving 99 in certain skills or experience. Kudos 2 U Talk! Edit count! Contribs! 10:11, 31 December 2008 (UTC)
I have seen such information vandalised with people putting their own names in rather, than the person who actually did get first to 99 or whatever, and how are we supposed to know unless they are very well known? I'm not sure why this player related stuff is in these articles at all. Most of it has only survived because it is embedded in larger articles, not that it should, but creating an article purely about one person should rightly have been deleted. Hurston (T # C) 11:05, 1 January 2009 (UTC)
Comment on user info - The toughest problem I find with information about individual user accomplishments is mainly one of verifiability. Yes, I know you can look at the high scores page for top users and find what their skill levels are right now, but it is difficult to "go back in time" and find who was the "first" to reach a certain accomplishment like the first to get level 99 in Summoning. I admit that this particular accomplishment by Gertjaars is something of a singular accomplishment in the annals of players in the game, and that getting to max experience points is something of a game itself.
I still think, in spite of what is a remarkable accomplishment, it still isn't remotely notable in that this particular user did nothing that has any sort of long-term impact on the game. If this player suddenly stopped playing, would anything in the game be different? Besides besting high scores, what else has been accomplished? To me, that is just a rather empty accomplishment, even if it is something of note between one player and another. Then again, I consider people who compare combat levels and skill levels to a bunch of kids trying to compare various parts of their anatomy to each other trying to suggest who is bigger or not. With few exceptions, it really doesn't matter a whole lot. --Robert Horning 09:04, 2 January 2009 (UTC)
I'm with Bonziibob. 4 skills to 200mil is History, as he said, and this wiki is "The Encyclopedia for all things Runescape" Including the History of Runescape. However, I think we create a page called something such as "Runescape History" or "Runescape Timeline", which has all dates of note from the first person to get a 99 (If we could ever prove that...) to first 99's in skills or 200mils in skills, or even clan related incidents that the community has decided is worth to be noted in Runescape's History.Before long, we are never goin g to be able to verify any piece of high level achievements, so I think that screenshots should be taken of the name etc, as well as the date.Runescape and its community is always changing, and records need to be kept.--Zilenserztalk! Join the RSWP today! 19:46, 7 January 2009 (UTC)