Difference between revisions of "Forum:Greenscreen"

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{{Forumheader|Yew Grove|name=Greenscreen|subject=|archive=|closure=|date=|user=|type=|notes=}}
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{{Forumheader|Yew Grove|name=Greenscreen|subject=Using green background for recording GIF animations.|archive=true|closure=allow|date=21 April 2019 02:59 (UTC)|user=Salix of Prifddinas|type=content|notes=}}
   
 
The purpose of {{wp|greenscreen}} in videos is to allow the background to be easily replaced, or the subject cut out and isolated. It is not meant to be left in as a permanent backdrop. Since we do not apply transparency to gifs, greenscreen has no purpose in animations on the wiki besides being an eyesore. It looks worse than standard ground styles and would likely fail minimum contrast requirements for accessibility if it were text.
 
The purpose of {{wp|greenscreen}} in videos is to allow the background to be easily replaced, or the subject cut out and isolated. It is not meant to be left in as a permanent backdrop. Since we do not apply transparency to gifs, greenscreen has no purpose in animations on the wiki besides being an eyesore. It looks worse than standard ground styles and would likely fail minimum contrast requirements for accessibility if it were text.

Latest revision as of 03:00, 21 April 2019

Forums: Yew Grove > Greenscreen
Archive
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This thread was archived on 21 April 2019 by Salix of Prifddinas.

The purpose of greenscreen in videos is to allow the background to be easily replaced, or the subject cut out and isolated. It is not meant to be left in as a permanent backdrop. Since we do not apply transparency to gifs, greenscreen has no purpose in animations on the wiki besides being an eyesore. It looks worse than standard ground styles and would likely fail minimum contrast requirements for accessibility if it were text.

I propose amending the animation section in RS:IMAGES to suggest that users not use the POH greenscreen or bluescreen floors, and if they do, allow others to mark the images with the retake template.

Discussion

Support as nominator. Iiii I I I 16:46, 7 April 2019 (UTC)

Oppose - Such a small amount of people currently take gifs, and if this passes, I personally won't be making any more. I'm not going to bother changing between regular grass and green screen for every gif/any other picture. As for marking it with a retake template, that's such a waste as there are much more pressing gifs to be retaken. Talk-to Kelsey 16:52, 7 April 2019 (UTC)

@KelseW: If you don't want to keep switching back and forth then just stick with the normal ground textures. Greenscreen isn't strictly necessary even for stills, since most people use the lasso tool for transparency, not color selection. Iiii I I I 05:13, 10 April 2019 (UTC)
No, the greenscreen is used for images that also need translucency, so sticking on just a grassy one isn’t an option either. Talk-to Kelsey 12:49, 10 April 2019 (UTC)

Neutral - I don't really mind the outcome of this discussion. I don't think it's an issue but hey, if u wanna go ahead and change everything to {{retake animation}} go ahead and we'll have more content for oswf. meRds msg meRds msg 19:14, 7 April 2019 (UTC)

Oppose - per Kelsey. Most people who take images for the wiki use a green screen for stills. People can't be expected to take time switching the background. JaydenKieran 19:27, 7 April 2019 (UTC)

@JaydenKieran: Greenscreen is objectively unattractive. We should be basing policy on what looks better to people reading the wiki, not what's most convenient for you. Iiii I I I 05:13, 10 April 2019 (UTC)
There's a fine balance to be made here. By discouraging people from uploading GIFs taken in their green POH, we're potentially losing editors that could be improving the wiki by adding GIFs for the readers you mention. JaydenKieran 10:55, 15 April 2019 (UTC)

Oppose - It also simply shows the animation without the issue of minor ground clipping. Twig Talk 772kZGs.png 21:21, 7 April 2019 (UTC)

@Man tag1: Several of the POH ground types are completely flat. Ground clipping is not an issue. Iiii I I I 05:13, 10 April 2019 (UTC)

Comment - My only point of support on this is the neon green is really burning. I don't find it necessary to change, it would just be a lot easier on the eyes. Then again, I do have an unaddressed issue with one of my eyes... Badassiel (talk) 02:16, 8 April 2019 (UTC)

Oppose - I like greenscreens. svco4bY.png3Gf5N2F.png 02:30, 8 April 2019 (UTC)

Oppose - per kelsey / although yes i agree that it looks nicer without greenscreen, not worth making into policy Star Talk ayy lmao ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) 05:41, 8 April 2019 (UTC)

Comment - Well, how hard would it be to trans it, would it look nice? Sealed clue scroll (master).png: Inventory image of Sealed clue scroll (master)MelmelcomRSCrystal triskelion.png: Inventory image of Crystal triskelion 15:30, 8 April 2019 (UTC)

You'd be transing every frame, which could be a lot. I'm not even sure if transparency is actually supported. cqm talk 19:44, 8 April 2019 (UTC)
Transparency is supported, but in my experience makes the file size a lot larger. Last I recall, translucency isn't supported. Things may have changed and there may be image/video formats that support a 'moving' transparency or translucency (moving as in pixels change visibility). Badassiel (talk) 23:05, 11 April 2019 (UTC)

Comment - Seeing as the current process for transparency on images doesn't really include and greenscreen based processes, would the change to having a less vibrant ground actually affect anything? Choose OptionTalk-to MitcheII Slayer of Imps (skill: 834)    Talk-to MitcheII Slayer of Imps (skill: 834) 09:34, 9 April 2019 (UTC)

Support - I at least support the second half of the proposal, that allows users to mark these gifs for retake. I don't think that most people would still take them on greenscreens to be a good reason to not allow them to be marked for retakes. People who want to still take it on greenscreens still can, while if there is someone who is willing to put in effort to make these look nicer (because I think most people would agree that the greenscreen is a bit ugly) can do so at their convenience. As for there being other gifs that could better be retaken, I don't think anyone sees the retake template list as something to do in the order that things were added. I think most users will triage the list based on what they consider to be most important or most interesting to them. I don't really see why this would be a bad idea, since if someone considers something else to be more important to retake, they'll go do that instead, and if someone considers this more interesting, we can't just presume they'd be willing to do the other retakes. Granted I'm not really sure how my position is really different from the status quo, other than the retake template, since I think right now if people were to update the gifs to non-greenscreen backgrounds most people would not object to their replacement. Liquid 12:32, 9 April 2019 (UTC)

People did object to their replacement, I forgot to mention that's why I started this thread. Here's the context from Discord:
[7:09 AM] Kelsey: why did u tag [[File:Lil Gloop emote.gif]] with a retake @Iiii_I_I_I
[7:09 AM] Kelsey: there's no rules about green floor?
[10:23 AM] Iiii_I_I_I: look bad
[10:23 AM] Kelsey: that aint a rule, fuck u
[10:24 AM] Iiii_I_I_I: that's what the retake template is for
[10:25 AM] Iiii_I_I_I: of course there's no rule against bad screenshots
[10:25 AM] Kelsey: the retake template is there if it doesnt meet the rules
[10:25 AM] Kelsey: not because you decree that it looks bad
Iiii I I I 18:31, 9 April 2019 (UTC)
Oh okay I didn't realize that retake template was for things against the style guide. In that case I don't really care either way but I would hope that no one would object if someone uploaded a non-greenscreen version. Liquid 22:22, 9 April 2019 (UTC)

Support - Given the limited number of colors available in gifs a solid color ground style seems like a good idea... but I agree that the green/blue screen styles aren't easy on the eye. Iiii I I I's reply to Jayden sums up how I feel about this nicely. Mining cape (t).png Rune14 (talk) Mining cape (t).png 15:09, 10 April 2019 (UTC)

Support - I don't see any issues with officially having a preference for non-greenscreen backgrounds -- the green is unnatural and unlike any other background in the game. The only thing this proposal is saying is that, all else equal, we'd prefer a normal background over pure #00FF00. That feels pretty common-sense. ʞooɔ 20:40, 10 April 2019 (UTC)

Support - (What Liquid, Rune14, and Cook said.) - Rawny (talk) 22:48, 10 April 2019 (UTC)

Oppose - Per Kelsey and others, I don't think it's worth prohibiting. Best to continue as status quo. 9xFavoY.pngScuzzy Betahib8CAd.png 00:58, 12 April 2019 (UTC)

This proposal doesn't prohibit anything... ʞooɔ 13:03, 13 April 2019 (UTC)
Being tagged for replacement is just prohibiting it with extra steps. -9xFavoY.pngScuzzy Betahib8CAd.png 07:59, 15 April 2019 (UTC)

Another comment - Ok yeah, changing house floor just because of this is stupid, but we could just take gifs somewhere else (inside an empty POF pen for example, or anywhere else without players, we can prob figure out something). meRds msg meRds msg 01:02, 12 April 2019 (UTC)

Eh - I agree that the green is straining on the eyes, and don't mind tagging the images for retake, but people shouldn't prioritise retaking them. Haidro (talk) 01:15, 12 April 2019 (UTC)

Support - Do people not realise there is a place to record GIFs that ISN'T the POH? Like, the rest of the game world? There are plenty of spots where you should be able to take GIFs without obstruction just as well as you would in a POH if you can't be arsed to switch your ground style. User talk:ThePsionic.png: Inventory image of User talk:ThePsionic ThePsionic Special:Contributions/ThePsionic.png: Inventory image of Special:Contributions/ThePsionic 07:43, 15 April 2019 (UTC)

None are as good as the POH. I'm more than open to suggestions that are better. However, please keep in mind every variable that goes into GIF taking. Talk-to Kelsey 04:47, 19 April 2019 (UTC)
EDIT: I guess per Merds, but a little more angry. User talk:ThePsionic.png: Inventory image of User talk:ThePsionic ThePsionic Special:Contributions/ThePsionic.png: Inventory image of Special:Contributions/ThePsionic 07:45, 15 April 2019 (UTC)

Oppose policy but would prefer non-greenscreen - Don't think its adding a retake template but maybe a note saying non-greenscreen is prefferred'.   SuperiosityQuick chat button.png: Yo, what's up   03:24, 18 April 2019 (UTC)

Support/comment - It definitely would be nice to see fewer greenscreens and I agree with all support comments so far. I also agree with Kelsey's and Jayden's oppose though, so I'd propose a combination of what Cook and Superiosity said: Update the style guide to say that GIFs should be taken with a neutral background and mention that normal backgrounds are prefered over greenscreens. Existing or future greenscreen GIFs don't necessarily need to be retaken (although it should be accepted if someone does so anyway). Attamaris (talk) 10:21, 20 April 2019 (UTC)

Closed - I think Attamaris sums it up nicely:

Update the style guide to say that GIFs should be taken with a neutral background and mention that normal backgrounds are prefered over greenscreens. Existing or future greenscreen GIFs don't necessarily need to be retaken (although it should be accepted if someone does so anyway).
Attamaris

Farming-icon.png Salix of Prifddinas (Talk) Prifddinas lodestone icon.png 02:54, 21 April 2019 (UTC)