Forum:Calculatorspace

From the RuneScape Wiki, the wiki for all things RuneScape
Jump to: navigation, search
Forums: Yew Grove > Calculatorspace
Archive
This page or section is an archive.
Please do not edit the contents of this page.
This thread was archived on 14 March 2011 by Cook Me Plox.

As made evident in Forum:Improvement, our lack of quality calculators has been holding us back. As such, I've made it a goal to create and improve enough calculators to put us on par with RuneHQ and Tip.it, in that regard. I've always been under the impression that calculators are one of the most important things a fansite can offer, so it's strange that we have them all condensed into subpages of Calculators. A namespace for them would be much more appropriate.

Consider the following advantages:

  • Calculators will not be condensed into subpages, which is more organized.
  • The template subpages, which are currently in the mainspace (this bothers me), will have a more appropriate place to go.

And the disadvantage:

  • We will have to move and re-link all the existing calcs. A bot can do this, so I don't see this as an issue.

I admit that I have (mistakenly) asked a Wikia staff member to create the namespace already. Even if Wikia does create it, I will not touch it unless this thread passes.

Magic-icon.pngStelercusIlluminated Book of Balance.png 21:18, February 18, 2011 (UTC)

Discussion

Support - As nom. Magic-icon.pngStelercusIlluminated Book of Balance.png 21:18, February 18, 2011 (UTC)

Support - Great idea. The main problem with our calculators is that they are very disorganized, many people don't even know we have them. bad_fetustalk 21:23, February 18, 2011 (UTC)

Support - If that that one small disadvantage is it, then this can only help. Plus, it might help make people more aware to our calculators. ɳex undique 21:26, February 18, 2011 (UTC)

Strong support - Your disadvantage isn't even a disadvantage. A few hours of automated work is nothing! 222 talk 21:52, February 18, 2011 (UTC)

What? - We have functional calculators on the wiki? Where?!?!? (oh, and support) --LiquidTalk 21:57, February 18, 2011 (UTC)

Support - This would improve organization and hopefully emphasize the importance and presence of our calculators. Now if only Wikia would get around to my support requests for getting RSHiscores working again. - TehKittyCatTalk Wikian-Book 22:04, February 18, 2011 (UTC)

Support And they should be easy to find on the main page 16px‎AtlandyBeer.png 22:53, February 18, 2011 (UTC)

Support - Rather self-explanatory Andrew talk 22:59, February 18, 2011 (UTC)

Support - No reason not to. Hunter cape (t).png Sentra246Blue hallowe'en mask.png 00:41, February 19, 2011 (UTC)

Oppose Support - I refuse to support excellent ideas! It's an excellent idea. Real Nub 09:14, February 19, 2011 (UTC)

Support - We could give them a portal? Maybe that'd be a bit too far though.   Swizz Talk   Events!   11:01, February 19, 2011 (UTC)

Comment - (This comment assumes that the proposal passes.) I'd like to request that bots not move the pages into the new namespace, because the pages as they currently stand are messy and need to be reorganized. I figure the most effective way to do this would be as part of moving them into the new namespace. Magic-icon.pngStelercusIlluminated Book of Balance.png 19:01, February 19, 2011 (UTC)

Support - Good idea and would motivate ppl to make more calcs :D. Quest point cape.pngTalk Newbie856 edit count Nomad guideMusic icon.png 19:26, February 19, 2011 (UTC)

Support - Also could we see about getting a fuction whereby you enter your character name and it retrieves your stats from HS? Can get rather bothersome having to check what my Prayer level is when I'm trying to figure out when I'll next level combat What I've done Ciphrius Kane Talk 15:27, February 20, 2011 (UTC)

Comment - In the IRC, you can set RuneScript to retrieve character data from the hiscores. Can we use something similar here?
Catcrewser is waiting on Wikia to get back to his support request to fix RSHighscores, which has been broken since July last year or so. Quest.png Gaz Lloyd 7:^]Events!99s 17:21, February 20, 2011 (UTC)

Support - If they'll give us a fifth namespace... Ajraddatz 16:03, February 20, 2011 (UTC)

Comment - Alright, we have almost all skill calculators available (only missing 5), but they still need a lot of work. First, we need to add xp bonuses such as brawlers, sacred clay stuff and whatnot. But most importantly, we need to standardize the calculators so they all have the same format (just compare the tables of Calculator:Woodcutting, Skill calculators/Prayer calculator and Skill calculators/Cooking calculator). We need to figure out what format is the most user-friendly while being not too much laggy. After this in mind, it will be easier to create the calculators once and for all and not have to redo it because it does not concord with the policy. While we're at it, why not create a class for calculator table? I think standardization is better than non-standardization, imagine if all of the wiki pages were written with a different font! Quest point cape.pngTalk Newbie856 edit count Nomad guideMusic icon.png 16:45, February 20, 2011 (UTC)

I've been planning this:
  • Create a series of basic skill calculators that don't calculate bonuses, unless the skill has few bonuses anyway. These would also include the GEMW cost/XP tables, which would be replaced by the calculator result if somebody uses the calculator (example).
  • Create a series of more advanced calculators based on the original basic calcs that factor everything in, XP wise.
  • Create a series of financial calculators that determine costs/profits instead of XP amounts, as it would be messy having all those things in one.
  • Standardize the page format for all the calcs, including the formula information, template links, and so forth.
  • Once all these things are done for a particular calc, move them into the new namespace.
Obviously, other people would have to be involved. Magic-icon.pngStelercusIlluminated Book of Balance.png 18:46, February 20, 2011 (UTC)

Support - Sure. (I'd also like to note that I've always put my calculator template code in the template namespace.) Quest.png Gaz Lloyd 7:^]Events!99s 17:21, February 20, 2011 (UTC)


Passed - There was unanimous support for the proposal, and a new namespace will bring much needed organisation and notability to our calculators. The namespace was requested by myself just now, as it seems Wikia has not yet responded to Steler's request. This is not closed, though, as we should decide how to implement this.

Implementation

So we need to discuss how to move the calculators across, and how to organise them in the future. I recommend some kind of standard/template on all calculators. This isn't my avenue, so you guys discuss! Cheers, Chicken7 >talk 07:19, February 27, 2011 (UTC)

Notice - Just got word from Wikia that the new namespace is live and activated. Chicken7 >talk 12:29, February 27, 2011 (UTC)

Comment - With the suggestion by C7, I made [[Calculators/Fishing next]], for use on the portal page. I suggest we start making this kind of calcs for all skills.
About using the new namespace, I suggest we move all calcs to the namespace(maybe with a bot, but if there are no bot-coders willing to do this, I'll do it) and then have the calcs's templates moved to Calculator:Template/calcname so that the search suggestion box won't pop up the template pages, which are useless for visitors. JOEYTJE50TALKpull my finger 12:51, February 27, 2011 (UTC)

Moving them all in with a bot would be a bad idea. The calculator pages as they currently stand are an absolute mess, so using a bot would only move that mess from one namespace to another. Magic-icon.pngStelercusIlluminated Book of Balance.png 12:56, February 27, 2011 (UTC)
Should I start moving them manually then? JOEYTJE50TALKpull my finger 18:49, February 27, 2011 (UTC)
No. "My plan was to ensure that individual calculators are 'up to standards' before moving them into the new namespace." At the least, we should wait until this discussion is over before moving the pages. Magic-icon.pngStelercusIlluminated Book of Balance.png 20:24, February 27, 2011 (UTC)

Comment - My plan was to ensure that individual calculators are "up to standards" before moving them into the new namespace. Some of them have redlinks, missing images, and so forth. Then, for each skill calculator, divide them into three categories: basic, advanced, and financial. The basic calculator would determine how many "things" you must do to reach a certain level with few parameters for possible bonuses. The advanced calculator would take all these things into account. The financial calculator would then determine the costs/profits of all these things. It's best to keep them all separate as to not make the calculators too complex. Finally, all calculators would be structured like this, minus the cost/xp table, which would only appear as an additional feature on the basic calcs or wherever else appropriate.

As a naming convention, I suggest something like "Calculator:Fishing (basic/advanced/financial)" for the skill calculators, then whatever for the rest. Magic-icon.pngStelercusIlluminated Book of Balance.png 12:54, February 27, 2011 (UTC)

Sounds good. Remember, the namespace is not plural. Are you going to have Calculator:Fishing, then put the basic/adv/financial as subpages or make all 3 completed separate, maybe linked by a nav box? One more thing, I still don't understand calculators at all. That Fishing example is still fairly confusing to me :P Could you maybe make a short guide, and I see no harm implementing your proposal JUST for Fishing to give us all an idea of what you're on about. One other thing, maybe add the thing Joey made as a fourth type for skills: "Ability" or something, I dunno. Cheers, Chicken7 >talk 13:14, February 27, 2011 (UTC)
I will make an example of the fishing calc in the new namespace, which we can delete once this thread is over (unless we decide to keep it). Magic-icon.pngStelercusIlluminated Book of Balance.png 20:26, February 27, 2011 (UTC)

So... - So the idea is to have "Calculator:Skill (basic/advanced/financial)" and "Calculator:Subject" and then "Calculator:Template/Calculatorname" for the template. If nobody disagrees in 2 days I think I'll BB, and start moving all calculators to that. Anyone else who wants to help should note that the calculators themselves should also have the template = ... changed to the new name. JOEYTJE50TALKpull my finger 16:02, February 28, 2011 (UTC)

"My plan was to ensure that individual calculators are 'up to standards' before moving them into the new namespace." Can we do that instead? Magic-icon.pngStelercusIlluminated Book of Balance.png 00:04, March 1, 2011 (UTC)
Then I think I don't get what you mean there. Do you mean we should fix all current problems with calcs before moving? I don't really see any problems with the current calcs, other than that we have too few. JOEYTJE50TALKpull my finger 02:48, March 2, 2011 (UTC)
Some of them have broken links, could be merged with other calcs, need to be renamed, and other things. If we are going to all the trouble to move them, we should take the opportunity to fix all these problems. Magic-icon.pngStelercusIlluminated Book of Balance.png 19:54, March 2, 2011 (UTC)
Okay, I'll place all calcs in Category:Calculators that need to be checked, and checked calcs should have it removed then. If all calcs are checked, we could move them to the new namespace. JOEYTJE50TALKpull my finger 14:35, March 3, 2011 (UTC)
AWB is currently experiencing a bug, so adding it has to wait for a little while. JOEYTJE50TALKpull my finger 14:57, March 3, 2011 (UTC)
I tagged all calculators with Category:Calculators that need to be checked. All calcs that have been checked could simply have the category removed, and if the category is emptied we can move all calcs to the new ns, and have a nice, organised calculator namespace. JOEYTJE50TALKpull my finger 01:10, March 7, 2011 (UTC)

Support - This is a good idea, since calculators will keep less people,non-wikians and wikians alike, to not use other sites just for the sole purpose of calculators. Zaros symbol.pngChaos Monk Talk SignCoins 250.png 03:55, March 2, 2011 (UTC)

Comment - I know I might have a slightly biased opinion, but I honestly think that Calculator:Woodcutting looks much nicer than the fishing calculator shown (only talking about the table that appears after everything is submitted). It overall looks the same, but has nice colors Lol as well as using the coin template for money. I don't think that we should have 3 calcs for every skill, as it doesn't complicate things that much and will reduce a lot of work of creating multiple calculators and the pain of having to go through 3 pages for different calculations. Quest point cape.pngTalk Newbie856 edit count Nomad guideMusic icon.png 00:53, March 8, 2011 (UTC)

When I wrote the calculator, I made it so each row is the product of another template. The advantage of this is that if we wanted to add or change the colouring system, it would only take one edit. I didn't include images in the calc to decrease load time. Magic-icon.pngStelercusIlluminated Book of Balance.png 19:27, March 9, 2011 (UTC)
Oh, that's great! I guess we use the current fishing calc and modify the style later on as needed. Quest point cape.pngTalk Newbie856 edit count Nomad guideMusic icon.png 22:32, March 9, 2011 (UTC)

Closed - The calculator space has been enabled. ʞooɔ 22:27, March 14, 2011 (UTC)