Forum:"Attack speed"? No Need!

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This thread was archived on 24 September 2010 by Degenret01.

i noticed recently that loads of there boxes (on the side) has the attack speed box, but i find the box itself has no use at all, player don't know the speed of a monster, in fact there might not even care, im making a thread to sort out this problem, i simply cant remove it as it a wiki box, and it need to be noted first, i have noted some alternatives to this problem:


  1. Delete this Section
  2. Replace Section with "Kill Factor"
  3. Replace Section with new Section


as you know im not good with forums, so im trying to make it clear as possible, what im saying over all is the Attack Speed Section is useless on npc, please post you comments and support below, if you like to support my idea feel free, i myself find kill factor more useful as i wanna know how deadly it is. --Project Myface Parsonsda Talk | Sign Here | Project Myface Project Myface 19:55, September 20, 2010 (UTC)

Discussion

Oppose - First off, if they want to find out what attack speed means, they can click the link in the infobox. Secondly, "Kill factor" would be completely arbitrary. If people want to find out how deadly it is, they can find its attack speed and max hit, both of which are in the infobox. Can you explain in more detail what you mean by Kill factor? Also, would you mind if I cleaned up your post so it was a bit more readable? ʞooɔ 20:03, September 20, 2010 (UTC)

Oh, and cute rhyme. ʞooɔ 20:05, September 20, 2010 (UTC)

Oppose - Eh, what? I really don't understand "kill factor" and I think that knowing a monster's attack speed can be very useful. Especially for players like me that often prayer flash soul split/protect prayers, because they have to have a low enough attack speed to be able to do that. HaloTalk 20:11, September 20, 2010 (UTC)

Oppose - What...kill factor? Farming cape (t).png Lil cloud 9 Talk 20:32, September 20, 2010 (UTC)

Strong oppose - That's an informative piece of information that should be included. And kill factor? OMG! --LiquidTalk 22:02, September 20, 2010 (UTC)

Oppose - I think that the speed of the monster is a thing that is nice to know. SardominSign Me! 22:07, September 20, 2010 (UTC)

Oppose - Attack speed is very notable plus "kill factor"? What is this I don't even... Korasi's sword.png Archmage Elune  TalkHS Void knight deflector.png fetus is my son and I love him. 22:09, September 20, 2010 (UTC)

Comment Attack speed was pretty silly imo, I removed it. It was added without consensus so removing it is fine. But I do not see any benefit to the "kill factor" to be added.-- Degen says Unban TLUL  01:46, September 21, 2010 (UTC)

I think it's a good idea, and UCS could easily justify adding it. HaloTalk 01:47, September 21, 2010 (UTC)

Closed - Before adding content to such a widely used template, consensus should have been reached. Degen was in the right to remove it, and if anyone wants it back they should get consensus on either a different YG thread or on Template talk:Infobox Monster. Given Degen's actions there is no more merit to discussion on this thread. kitty.pngPsycho Robot talkSilver bar.png 01:53, September 21, 2010 (UTC)

Reopened - Degen was in the right to remove the attack speed, but that's not the only thing this forum is discussing. Discussion may continue on points two and three, as it's still a bit too early to close them, per recent discussion. --LiquidTalk 01:55, September 21, 2010 (UTC)

Soooo....What the **** is kill factor anyhow? How is it determined? Who determines it? What is the scale? Without this information this thread is pointless.-- Degen says Unban TLUL  04:31, September 21, 2010 (UTC)

Exactly what Degen said, including the slang - 222 talk 06:33, September 21, 2010 (UTC)

Oppose - I lol'd. bad_fetustalk 13:27, September 21, 2010 (UTC)

Oppose - Kill factor is attack accuracy * max damage / attack time in ticks? No that will not really work. Similar ways too. Rewlf2 15:03, September 21, 2010 (UTC)

Strong Oppuse - The kill factor is how dangerous a monster is, which Jagex kindly took the time to tell us by creating this little thing called a "combat level". As for the attack speed, i think its actually really useful, especially with boss monsters who hit very high, like jad. I think we should put it back, and before we delete stuff we should probably make a thread, because it's probably really hard for someone to get that information, whereas we can delete stuff with a few clicks. Sorry about the bold. Davidcu96 19:21, September 21, 2010 (UTC)

Request for closure - Unless Parsons can tell us what "kill factor" means, and how it can be calculated, can we close this? ʞooɔ 19:43, September 21, 2010 (UTC)

Forum:Have you ever seen the snow? has in its closing statement, "Legitimate discussions must remain open for at least one week." Closing this now means that you're ruling this discussion illegitimate. I really don't know if this is legitimate or not, since I see arguments to support both the legitimate and illegitimate views, but I'm just informing you of the current policy. --LiquidTalk 22:06, September 21, 2010 (UTC)
Well, of course RS:SNOW shouldn't come into play. But seeing as the primary objective of this thread has been accomplished (and the counter-argument is taking place on another thread), there is no reason to keep this open. In addition, the remainder of this discussion is completely illegitimate unless Parsons can tell us what "kill factor" is. ʞooɔ 22:13, September 21, 2010 (UTC)
If Parsons refuses to say what it is, then it's illegitimate. But, at least give him the chance to tell us. --LiquidTalk 22:15, September 21, 2010 (UTC)
Remember that RS:SNOW is an essay, not a policy. 222 talk 10:38, September 22, 2010 (UTC)

Sorry i forgot to visit the forum for a bit, here the answer to your questions:

kill factor?

Kill factor is a kill rating for the npc, showing you how deadly it is, for e.g the Corporeal Beast would have a kill Factor of "10" being the deadliest, while a lvl 1 man would have "0.5" being the lowest, another name for this could be Kill Rating it more useful then attack speed, this will let you know what ur going up against, so if it a big monster with a rating of 10, you can be fully ready.

What Wrong With Attack speed?

Attack speed to my view as a daily editor is useless on npc, for e.g say i was on a quest, doing nomad, i need all the information i can get, but the attack speed doesn't give me any useful information, it just says how fast it is, as im attacking nomad, i wount really want to know how fast he attack me, thoe with Kill Factor / Kill Rating i can know how dangerous this npc is, for a level 100 he may sound like a easy foe, and without the right equipment the player dies easy, but with this, you can check how dangerous he is, get the items you think is relevant for this foe, meaning the box helps, you don't die, you know the risk, and u know how to prepare, i myself find this really useful, as this has happen to mean in the past, not know how dangerous a npc was, i died and lost all my items worth a tone of cash, i did search the page before the fight, it looked safe, that what im trying to stop happening really, so in summery, changing the box to Kill Factor / Kill Rating will be a far more useful help then the current Attack Speed.

Removing it?

This is the Option many of you may choose, we just remove it, as it pointless, unused, and junk, do i see no point of having it!


Also i thought, if we do change this, we could have a coloured box, as in green for low kill Rating - man, and red for dangerous - Nomad


If you got any more questions pm me in game. --Project Myface Parsonsda Talk | Sign Here | Project Myface Project Myface 10:23, September 24, 2010 (UTC)


And how will it be calculated, and by who? 222 talk 10:28, September 24, 2010 (UTC)

it easy, just find out how deadly it is, not hard to do --Project Myface Parsonsda Talk | Sign Here | Project Myface Project Myface 10:52, September 24, 2010 (UTC)
Kill factor is something... er.... Determined by personal comments. It will be very controversional. Rewlf2 10:58, September 24, 2010 (UTC)

Oppose - Personally I see no use for this, as basically the combat level is already a way to measure a monsters "Kill Factor", and as Rewlf pointed out, a system determined by a users personal comments would be controversial. For example, a lower-levelled player could have a tougher time defeating a monster than a stronger, higher-levelled player would have, and all I can see coming out of this, is dozens of mini-edit wars from conflicting editors debating over the "Kill Factor" due their experience of defeating an enemy. The current system we have, and always have had, seems to be good enough at this moment in time. Ruud (talk)(Suggest me naems) 14:55, September 24, 2010 (UTC)

Request for closure (if not that Oppose) - As there is no official way to determine this, I think it should be closed. HaloTalk 15:09, September 24, 2010 (UTC)

Closed With kill factor being a personal opinion it would violate our NPOV perspective. This will not be added.-- Degen says Unban TLUL  15:13, September 24, 2010 (UTC)